How can these full grown women and men, who have jobs and children, act like such high schoolers?

It's an internet thing. Happens in every community (including, well, this one!)

Yeah, some communities have it worse than others though. I've had one decent flamout in my online life, and it was in an endometrosis support group mailing list that I had started. My flameout email was like ten pages long (er.. maybe only two) after watching many years of the chinese torture of the communities constant whiny bickering and stuff. If the group is like that now, it's unlikely to change, unless it has a very strong moderator that can steer clear. Those moderators are rare because it's one helluva tough job if group gets like that.

muddgirl, run away! I am familiar with the drama you are speaking of. Get out quick. :-)

I wish so very badly that I could post an email I received this morning from a member of our mom's group. It's catty, high-school behavior epitomized. I am about to bail on these people. Nobody is perfect, but why I am hanging out with snobby, rude, mean, stupid people is beyond me.

Too much bitching, and not enough stitching?

TPS - you're right, it's amazing how alike these things sound, no matter what board their on! This is weird for me, though, because it's rare to see Mefites (for example) drag arguments from the Real World onto the Blue, but with a locally-based group that seems unavoidable.

I guess the knitting itself really IS so boring... :)

Nobody is perfect, but why I am hanging out with snobby, rude, mean, stupid people is beyond me.

Indeed. It's fun to be bitchy for a little bit, but gets old when that's the atmosphere. Sometimes you have to take yourself away from it all. I just cleaned out my Facebook a few days ago- I realized, why do I have all these people who I hated and couldn't wait to get away from at my old school listed as "friends"? Removed, removed, removed. I got rid of over 70 "friends".

hm. i find that my worst experience with adults-acting-as-preteens wasn't an online one at all. last year in a fit of boredom i decided to join a local ballroom and swing dance social group (hey, it was cheaper than lessons, and a way to get me out of the house).

the scary thing was that almost all of these folks were *at least* 10-15 years older even than i am (and i'm no spring chicken mind you) and ZOMG HILARIOUS (not!) they were soooooo pettycattycliquey it was about 2 or 3 sessions before i decided 'meh, it really isn't me it's them and i so don't need this'

tho i absolutely agree that the anonymity of the internet can exacerbate this sort of thing, in this specific instance, not a single email was exchanged. all the craziness was old-skool real life bitchiness. it kind of reminded me of being stuck in a (bad!) rendition of a christopher guest movie.

sounds like fun. should these people be allowed near long pointy things

BWahahaha!

lfr, you're smart to get out quick. My situation is real-life also, but I've spent six years with these people. A lot of it is very cliquey, but I mostly just joing the group once or twice a month for dinners out, parties, etc. I've always had a nagging feeling that these aren't the people for me.

The email below email wasn't directed to me, I could give a rat's ass about birthday parties. It was directed to someone, and I think it's incredibly mean-spirited and rude to send an email like this to the entire group of people. The sender of the email knows very well who the offended party is, but chose to send this dramatic email anyway. I am about to drop out of this group because of the kind of drama below. I have plenty of normal friends, I have no idea why I have stuck around for this long. The "parking lot" discussion means that sometimes some of the women linger in the parking lot after the restaurant meal and chat before driving home. Thankfully I didn't attend the last dinner out, so I have no idea what they are talking about. Someone must of stated to another mom that they were offended that their children weren't invited to the drama-queen's kid's birthday party.

To Whom it may concern:

If you do not think this is directed at you, it probably isn't.

I have been informed that some people are offended that myself, my family or my children have not invited you or your children to events we have hosted over the past 6 months. My family - as does yours - has every right to invite whomever they choose and to not feel guilty about who wasn't invited. I have known many of you since our children were babies and as we grow up, we will grow apart. As mothers we may remain friends , but it is OK if my child does not pick yours to attend their party. I will not be friends with people so I can get a future invite or something in return. I refuse to invite all 50 plus children I know just to make a mommy happy. I don't have the patience or the desire to have everybody over all the time. No one should pass an opinion about who should or shouldn't come to my house or events. How do you know who I am friends with or how much time I spend with others? If you are that concerned with my life then maybe you should get a life of your own.

MY CHILDS PARTY INVITEES HAVE NO LINK TO MY ADULT RELATIONSHIPS.
I am teaching my kids to be independant and to make their own friends and decisions.

We have had a strong baby group in the past years but I believe we are hurting each other if we continue talking about others behind their backs and making judgements. On the same note, don't ask for someone's opinion and then get mad when they give it to you. I suggest we stop the " parking lot " discussions. If you are upset with somebody - friend or family - you should be strong enough to address the issue with them.. Most probably the third party you are complaining to doesn't want to hear it anyway. Or maybe misery loves company. I am only speaking for myself and these are only my opinions.
If friends are that easy to lose maybe they shouldn't have been friends to begin with.
I think its sad to feel more happiness when you are away from your friends than with your "support group." I try to live my life in the best way for my family and myself, not YOU. Maybe more people should consider this approach. Maybe if people directed as much attention to their own family as towards someone elses they would be better off.

I appreciate each and every relationship and I am not sending this with a malicious intent. Please realize if that was the intent, I wouldn't have worked this hard for the past five years to keep us connected and I wouldn't waste my time venting my frustration.

Sincerely,
Over-the-top drama queen

A lot of it is very cliquey, but I mostly just joing the group once or twice a month for dinners out, parties, etc. What the hell? That's a crappy sentence.

Muddgirl, apologies for posting this email in your thread. I thought it was fitting with the drama theme.

I wouldn't normally post something like this in public, but I think it's hilarious, and I really don't care anymore.

What's so funny about that e-mail is although the parties involved got all worked up and emotional, I have absolutely no idea what she's talking about. Which only makes it seem even sillier.

I am teaching my kids to be independant [sic] and to make their own friends and decisions.

Hopefully the kids will grow up to be a lot cooler than their mom.

Yeah, it is silly, and maybe it's silly for posting it. I guess a a little back story would be helpful, but I won't bore you with the mundane details of suburban moms and their cliquey groups.

Girl, I got enough drama of my own*; I probably couldn't even follow someone elses


*Like fucking clients who call at five fucking thirty on Friday about something they assumed I would do just because they said so. I AM NOT YOUR SLAVE; I am your vendor. I will get to it when I have the time; maybe if you had LOOKED at what I sent you THREE DAYS AGO, you wouldn't be in such a pickle! Plus, I don't think 24 hours is such a bad turnaround! SO SUCK IT, LADY!!! Ok, I feel better and now can fully enjoy my weekend.

I feel sort of hypocritical for complaining about drama, because I was a huuuge drama queen, from age 5 to age 17. But damnit, do what I do not what I did!

And damn, sometimes even now Metafilter brings out the drama beast in me. Must...not...rant...about...declawing...

but I won't bore you with the mundane details of suburban moms and their cliquey groups

You don't have to, Lori. I know exactly what that letter was about and immediately could pinpoint who in my mommy circle would write such a thing. (Actually, probably all of them. The cliques at my kids pre-school are effing BRUTAL.)

I love the "We should all just be concerned with our own families and not worry what other people think" content in a letter specifically designed to get everyone rubbernecking. Heh.

Heh. This has nothing to do with that type of drama but on one of my mailinglists - growing wild since I hardly moderate it - this just happened.
1st email onlist: "Here's a clip (link to really bad joke)"
2nd email from A onlist: "one of the worst attempts of viral marketing I have seen."
3rd email from B onlist: "Gee, here's a f00king brilliant idea. Let's hit REPLY TO ALL. Moron. "
4th email from C - never hits the list but is sent to B and myself: "please don;t spam me "
5th email from B sent only to C: "DUH! How long have you been a moron?"
C then emails B and myself asking "Ask. Do we need this sort of behavior on this list?"
I reply to C and B: No we don't. (I explain that the last bit never entered the list and is thus not a listmatter and end with)...This email is CC:d to both of you, It's 1:20 in the morning here, so I
wish a happy Saturday to you both as I raise my cold beer to ya. Cheerio!
C responds to me and B even though he probably only intended it for B by 'reply all': Ask yourself something that I ask of you: If I had wanted shit out of you, I would have squeezed your head. That does it. I am outta here. Watch my unsubscribed ass hit the road.
Clearly, he thinks my name was the word "ask". He sees my email and responds "Lick my hairy ass. I am outta here. You guys suck. "
I respond: Here, let me help you with that" and ban him.

Silly aren't they?

but I won't bore you with the mundane details of suburban moms and their cliquey groups

I was thinking on my way to dinner- it's some of those internet mommy groups that seem the nastiest of all! I have a blog friend who I've been reading for years who has adopted two girls from China and is also involved in some mommy type groups, and every now and then she'll respond to some comment from someone from one of the groups, and it is just awful! Perhaps it's the topic- something so personal and important- that gets people extra riled up?

Perhaps it's the topic- something so personal and important- that gets people extra riled up?

I think you have it TPS. I believe parents, especially moms, are riled up because a lot of them are insecure in their parenting. Parenting is incredibly stressful. Moms want to believe they are doing the right thing for their kids so they seek validation from other moms. Some mothers, usually the insecure ones, can be incredibly competitive and judgmental. It's all very cliquey. There is a social pecking-order, a lot of moms are clamoring to belong.

I am leery when a mom can't make fun of herself. We all make mistakes. It's as if nobody wants to admit they gave their toddler a sip of coke or a french fry. Everybody is trying to project an image of "perfect mommy, perfect home, perfect family". It's ridiculous. I'm very real with my friends, at times probably too self-deprecating.

There is another strange component in my mom's group. Most of the moms, not me, are incredibly wealthy. This adds another level of social competition. Thankfully I can look in from the outside and not have to worry about this nonsense. I won't be joining the yacht club anytime soon.

oh!oh! playgroups. What suburban moms? Do you know the beast that's called upper west side mom?

You know, I do not understand this whole concept of "playgroups". Do not get me wrong. Initially I thought it was a great idea. Last year I was part of a couple of those which, though, have already fallen apart. My main problem is, why should I hang out with people I do not like just because they got kids, my kids' age? True, you can always find people you like who happen to have kids, but, then, you call them friends. Not playgroup. Anyway, I wasn't keen on the scheduled thingy and several other issues, one of which was the "directives", the "that's the way you do it". If I wanted authoritarian advice on child rearing I would go to my mom's, thank you very much.

Now my kids do socialize but with the folks I do too. Seems okay, given that they also go to school where they meet other kids.