Oh. Wait. What? I didn't meant to put a novel on the front page, but I didn't see the Read More option. Color me noob'd.

*swirls Skwirl*

*colors Skwirl with favorite crayon, which is Macaroni and Cheese*

Oh, that was quick. Thankee moderator-type person.

And, uh, what was your question in all that, Skwirl?

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Haha um... where is the question?

Skwirl, you don't *need* a fixed gear. even i don't, quite frankly. it's a fad.

the mantra amongst hybrid and mtb fitters is: better too small than too large. reason being: an overly large bike is a safety hazard and a back problem.

see, the main thing most fitters never tell anyone is that you fit a bike by LENGTH, not by STANDOVER CLEARANCE.

go with the 18", buy at your local shop, have them put a riser bar and longer stem on (longer stem = better handling) and get proper maintenance done by the shop.

or buy an alternate used bike that fits properly, or save your money until you have enough to buy something that fits and works for you. DO NOT buy a department store bike. not only are they crap, they're unsafe crap and there's no guarantee the brakes won't fall off and the wheels won't fold up the first time you hit a pothole. and you'll wear out 4 or 5 department store bikes from Target by the time you kill the Jamis.

that 21" craigslist bike will not only be cramping your jewels and lower back, it will also handle like a 4'x8' sheet of plywood in anything but a straight line. don't do it.

Yes, do not buy a bike too large or a dept store bike.

Also: bikes are measured differently, so quoted sizes are only part of the information you need. You need to know if a frame is being measured "center-to-top" or "center-to-center", as well. The difference can be a half-inch, easily. (The measurement in both cases is from the center of the crank spindle to either the top or the center of the top tube.)

It's certainly best to stand above the bike, but if you're buying online, ask the seller to measure the bike for you to your specifications, so that you're always comparing the same number.

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Heehee....

oh man omiewise... i didn't even want to get into the measurements confusion... crap. too late.

see, this is why it's never a good idea to ask these questions on a NON cycling board.

seriously guys just go over to MTBR.com or roadbikereview.com. they have faqs pages and years and years of searchable content in their discussion boards.

really.

as to the whole center-center / center-top measurement debate... add to this:

-- is the bike a "sloping" or "traditional" frame?
-- does it have an "extended" seat tube?
-- when some manufacturers say "C-T" they don't actually mean "center to top", as in the top of the *seat tube*, they mean to the top of the *top tube*
-- what is the ACTUAL top tube length vs. the VIRTUAL top tube length? -- a sloping or "compact" frame is measured differently
-- some manufacturers measure frames by centimetres, not by inches
-- some manufacturers express sizes as S/M/L/XL

and on and on and on...

...

you see what I mean?

go forth young jedi and educate yourselves. or email any one of the contributors to these question threads.

here, don't say I never gave you anything.

ANYONE, if you're looking for bike info, bookmark these links:

Sheldon Brown's exhaustive cycling information website

All things road bike related, including reviews, classifieds, discussion forums and expertise in any realm.

the grandaddy of them all, same as above, for the mountain biker instead. a little more saucy and less uptight than RBR.

Doing good deeds, mountain bike variety

Doing one's part, roadie style.

last but not least

a bunch of dirty bike messengers

If you really love the Fuji, get it fixed. The chances of anyone falling in love with a low-end hybrid are close to zero (note: it's not about the money. If you want to fall in love with a cheap bike, get a cruiser, or a used touring bike, or an ancient (pre-ubiquitous suspension) mountain bike).

If you really love the Fuji, get it fixed.

exactly. i very nearly put this into my first reply to both CF and Skwirl, however...

in both cases, it sounds like the posters have worked themselves up to a point where they really, really feel like they want a brand, new, shiny, happy, non-squeaking/creaking/shimmying sexy new bicycle. doesn't matter if it's a pale imitation of their former steed. i sense Spring Madness here... a common enough phenomenon that's discussed at length on cycling forums. hey, i don't blame youall on the east coast for getting cabin fever. it's cold, it's dark, it's dreary, and seems like winter came late this year and now doesn't want to leave, right?

a new bicycle is just a dude's form of Retail Therapy, box. surely you know this?

oh wait, CitrusFreak already mentioned multiple times that his bike's a dog and he desperately needs something better. anyway don't mind me, it's beerthirty.

Yeah, CF needs a new old bike, but Skwirl needs to keep his existing bike. It's got a nickname, for Chrissake.

Also, re retail therapy: tell me about it. I just bought one of those Nike iPod thingies, and another tattoo will probably follow.

you're preaching to the choir dude, i've been seriously lusting after one of these

(my Pista desperately needs a new one, and no, you don't need to explain how putting a $130 headset on a sub-$200 bike is putting lipstick on a pig...)

Hey now. I CTRL-F lots of question marks here. Just none of them are relevant. My bad.

I meant to ask: What are the disadvantages of a too-large frame size versus a too-small frame size? Are they worth doubling the price of a low-end bike?

I test rode a lot of bikes at another bike shop and they were too small. The 21" felt right, but I'm worried about hopping off my seat at a stop-light into a pothole and losing a good portion of my reproductive abilities.

I've seriously considered the environmental and other trade-offs of fixing up my old bike, but by the time I spend my best budget on it, it will be safe but still have some large flaws. I might keep it around as a project bike, but I'm kind of a pack-rat and it will probably just continue to rust outside because we have no storage. I'm probably also nostalgia biased towards it.

I've read a lot about sizing. For instance, Sheldon's site says that the top tube length is more important, but he doesn't really go into detail about why. In fact, the top tube length on the 21" Jamis Explorer 1.0 is very close to my old bike and feels just-right with the riser bars. My specific worry is that if the top-tube length on the 21" is just-right, then it will suck for me on the 18". Is this a reasonable worry?

Thanks for helping me make an informed decision, folks.

Top tube length is important because that's how you ride, stretched out over the top tube.

Basically, the big thing to take from this thread is that bikes that you haven't ridden (or at least sat on) are a bit of a crapshoot.

I meant to ask: What are the disadvantages of a too-large frame size versus a too-small frame size?

um

what i said in my last paragraph here.

to wit: if your bike is too long, you will hurt. your nuts will hurt (because you'll be stretched too far forward and thus putting too much weight on your nuts rather than your sitbones, where it's supposed to be) your back will hurt (because you'll have your weight cantilevered awkwardly out forward, rather than balanced), your shoulders will hurt (cos they're trying to support all the weight of your upper body), your triceps will *really* hurt (ditto). in addition, an overly high and long bike makes it much tougher to 'handle' the bike gracefully; i.e. dodge potholes, make turns at speed, et cetera.

your centre of balance and the bulk of your bodyweight should be plumb over the bottom bracket. if you have to 'reach', you throw everything forward and your balance goes all out of wack.

this is why top tube length is so important.

and i have looked at the geometry of the Jamis. those numbers are pretty misleading in how the bike is measured because the frame is so 'sloping'. my advise? ride them BOTH. reason being there IS a vast difference in TT length between the 18" and 21" sizes. it's 2cm, and you may not think that's much but in the fit world, it's actually a lot, and it can throw your whole fit/balance deal out of whack.

Are they worth doubling the price of a low-end bike?

c'mon dude, you're asking a bunch of people on the internet you've never met and who have no idea of your true bike fit to make that call? really, go sit / ride on both and/or get a professional fit done. err, and yea, what omiewise said.

and yes, it is absolutely worth it if it means riding vs. not riding the thing owing to discomfort issues related to fit.

read the whole thread again. i think we tried to answer your question. however, if you're hellbent on buying the craigslist bike cos it's such a "great deal" (remember what i said about "great deals" in the CitrusFreak thread?), and/or you have remorse at having the guy do a buncha work for a sale he might not make, well... i can't talk you out of it.

Thanks lonefrontranger. That is actually really good advice. A lot of my problem is that I know just enough about bikes to be dangerous but not enough to be confident at a bike shop, especially since real bike shops have nothing but bikes outside my affordability on the floor. (I did test ride a lot of bikes at the Community Cycling Center, which fits my financial niche, but no bikes felt right.)

For what it's worth, I'd ride any bike despite possible discomfort, but, yeah, that's a bad idea.

And yeah, we (most askers) whine on the Internet not to get real advice but to have other people with no stakes in a situation validate the default answer. At least I didn't post a relationship question! And in this case, it has changed my mind to steer towards the less convenient, more intelligent option.

its ok Skwirl, i understand. keep in mind i'm a cycling coach. it's my JOB to tell people what they don't want to hear.