MetaChat - I quit.

I'll miss you over there, but it's probably good for your mental health.

posted by interrobang 14 November | 12:09

Krrlson's just an ass.

posted by amberglow 14 November | 12:11

Well. I didn't really need a reminder of (one of the many reasons) why I locked my Metafilter account, but thanks anyway.

Welcome to the other side.

posted by With move as the Kimchi the user who knows 14 November | 12:13

Just don't read Metatalk. Avoid political threads. There's still a lot of great stuff over there; it just takes more filtering.

posted by goatdog 14 November | 12:15

It's not just Krrlson, amberglow. There are a dozen others like him and rothko. Add to that the influx of new users and the departure of many of the older users, and it's just too much for me.

posted by brainwidth 14 November | 12:15

Well, ignore MeTa then...it's just another purposely induced catfight--they happen all the time. And there have always been assholes there, but they're still outnumbered by interesting, non-asshole people.

posted by amberglow 14 November | 12:19

That thread is just terrible. brainmonju, listen to goatdog. [I'll not forget your introducing me to WaltWhitman in my Walt Whitman thread -- still goes through my head from time to time.]
But yeah....tackle the MeFi beast on terms that reduce your angst. There are still pearls to be found.

posted by peacay 14 November | 12:26

I'm warped. I wanna bring popcorn to those threads. But then I am easily amused.

posted by bunnyfire 14 November | 12:36

There are a dozen others like him and rothko

"Like Krrrlson and me?" What are you talking about? I'm not the one who posted that thread.

How about you and every other person on that site tired of the trolling take it up with the responsible party? Hmm? For once. How about it? Instead of blaming me.

How about blaming the trolls there? How about it? Why is that too much fucking effort?

posted by AlexReynolds 14 November | 12:36

um, yer a dick.

posted by quonsar 14 November | 12:40

"Like Krrrlson and me?" What are you talking about?

I'm talking about people that get off on the grudge match. Both you and Krrrlson easily qualify. Look at how many times you commented in that MeTa thread.

How about blaming the trolls there? How about it? Why is that too much fucking effort?

Because there aren't any trolls. There are only people who don't like you. FUCK! Now you have me arguing about this here, too. You win, Alex. I'm gone.

posted by brainwidth 14 November | 12:41

Quonsar, you're a dick too but you don't see me going around posting that everywhere. So give it a rest.

posted by AlexReynolds 14 November | 12:42

Because there aren't any trolls. There are only people who don't like you.

That post was a troll.

I don't want to argue with you about it. But don't blame me for your decisions that have absolutely nothing to do with me. Thanks.

posted by AlexReynolds 14 November | 12:45

Jesus Christ. Don't drag this shit over here, Alex.

posted by interrobang 14 November | 12:45

Don't bring the grudge matches here, gents. Thanks.

posted by jonmc 14 November | 12:46

Interrobang, tell it to the people who start these threads!

posted by AlexReynolds 14 November | 12:48

Alex is right. It was a troll post aimed at starting another fight with him. (you have to stop responding to them tho--they keep doing it because you always jump in--i know it's easier said than done tho)

posted by amberglow 14 November | 12:48

alex, as a peice offering, I am eating your city's national dish today.

And don't start with that "New York can't make a good one," shit. these are Philly expats.

posted by jonmc 14 November | 12:53

Fuck this noise.

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by sciurus 14 November | 13:04

That is one fluffy bunny!

posted by grouse 14 November | 13:10

What is this tripe?

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by goatdog 14 November | 13:13

Metafilter trainwreck threads are best taken with a grain of salt, a bit of good humor and a glass of bourbon.

I have to confess that I don't understand the mentality that leads people to get so emotionally involved and agitated about the blue and the gray...

posted by killdevil 14 November | 13:24

killdevil wins. That is exactly the right attitude. I enjoy MeTa best if I view it as comic farce when it gets to that point. There's just no other way to take it.

posted by Doohickie 14 November | 13:36

monju_bosatsu,

I, for one, would like to sincerely ask that you stick around. I think you are one of the most interesting posters on the website. Hmm... on the chance you are already gone, I'll email you, as well.

But if you haven't, please stick around!!

posted by dios 14 November | 13:39

For me, the most annnoying thing about the whole PreOpTrannieSockPuppet affair was to find out that a few people knew who was who for months. The same little birdie who dropped a clue about that on me later wrote someone else and hinted that there may be a grand annotated sock puppet thread to come. outing everyone all at once. If so, bring it--get it over with. I'm tired of people creating sockpuppets to play games and I'm tired of people figuring out who these self same gaming sockpuppets are and not telling the rest of us from the git go when they find out.

posted by y2karl 14 November | 13:48

*throws popcorn at combatives, then goes off to procure raisinets*

posted by bunnyfire 14 November | 13:52

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by agropyron 14 November | 13:54

Just don't read Metatalk. Avoid political threads.

That's a great idea in principle, one that I followed when I signed up. Unfortunately, even if you choose to ignore the political threads, they don't ignore you. One case I that really crystallized this for me was this silly zombie thread, which was needlessly politicized and ended with one participant telling a bunch of the others to fuck off.

The bottom line is: Metafilter is a political site, with all of the hostility and grudge-holding that implies. It's quite obviously what the vast majority of the members -- especially the new members -- sign up for. I don't think that's necessarily by design or that it had to end up that way, but that's the way it is. I also don't think there's anything wrong with that --whatever floats your boat. But if you're mainly interested in the beautiful, the strange, or the quirky, then Metafilter is (no longer) the right place for those things -- they don't live comfortably alongside the needless hostility; they're merely tolerated. Take a look at the thread comment counts and it's obvious what Metafilter is interested in.

posted by With move as the Kimchi the user who knows 14 November | 14:12

Also, I would like to say for the record that tripe is yummy.

posted by With move as the Kimchi the user who knows 14 November | 14:14

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by With move as the Kimchi the user who knows 14 November | 14:16

Right now I'm not reading very far into threads because of the animal cruelty ad on Metafilter. I don't need to see some animal crammed into a cage being abused in every thread.

I don't know why it really bothers me, but I focus on it each time I see it and I wish the ad weren't there.

posted by druja 14 November | 14:23

Metafilter is a political site, with all of the hostility and grudge-holding that implies. It's quite obviously what the vast majority of the members -- especially the new members -- sign up for ... But if you're mainly interested in the beautiful, the strange, or the quirky, then Metafilter is (no longer) the right place for those things

Hm. Well, the last time it was discussed (a couple of years ago?), I remember someone saying most visitors only visit the front page and click on the links. So it's only a fraction of visitors that actually read the comments.

Considering the number of members, It's probably safe to say that the majority of members are doing the same thing. It's just a website, with a miniscule faction of users that are compelled to antagonize each other.

blah. I still visit almost every day, I've just figured out what to avoid. So what? Big deal.

posted by whatnot 14 November | 14:39

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by quonsar 14 November | 14:43

I agree, don't bring this crap here, Alex.

Look, the people you consider trolls really don't seem like trolls to me. I don't think there are any prolific trolls on metafilter right now at all. Shouting was the last one I remember.

They might disagree with me in some incomprehensible way, but that doesn't make them trolls (Just wrong, heh :P)

People are going to insult you. People insult me on metafilter, and I try not to hold it against them. I try to avoid ever brining up a disagreement in another thread, that's not very difficult for me, but it's honestly something you should try to work on. If someone pisses you off, just relax.

posted by delmoi 14 November | 15:25

I don't know why it really bothers me, but I focus on it each time I see it and I wish the ad weren't there.

If you buy an account, you won't see ads.

posted by delmoi 14 November | 15:30

I agree, don't bring this crap here, Alex.

I didn't bring anything here. This person, did, however. Take it up with him.

posted by AlexReynolds 14 November | 15:35

I bought an account. I haven't felt the urge to post any time recently, so I haven't emailed asking for my password. It's saved at home in my browser, but not at work. Also, because of my work I'm regularly reading the site from a new computer, install, browser, or PDA.

I think the ad is in bad taste.

posted by druja 14 November | 15:39

didn't bring anything here. This person, did, however. Take it up with him.
posted by AlexReynolds 14 November

For fuck's sake! monju_bosatsu did not bring any flamewar here regarding you! He was merely clarfying a cryptic comment on Metafilter for those who were interested. Where the hell do you get off blaming him?

monju_bosatsu seems to be a very fair-minded, respectful, and personable guy. I can't believe you are going to suggest that your tantrum is somehow his fault. I have stayed out of that Meta thread and haven't been addressing you, but you trying to blame m_b just goes too far.

He is a good guy who will be missed if he leaves.

posted by dios 14 November | 15:45

He is a good guy who will be missed if he leaves.

'Struth.

posted by deadcowdan 14 November | 15:49

≡ Click to see image ≡

Internet insults can be very damaging, and its understandable that people will get angry at other people, but "I know you are, but what am I?" retorts are best left on the playground. Can we conduct civilized disagreements on the internet? Lil Bunny would like to think so...

posted by muddgirl 14 November | 15:50

It's pictures like that which make me wonder why I don't own a bunny.

posted by selfnoise 14 November | 15:53

muddgirl, i'm diabetic. Please don't post pics like that where I can get at them; they might put me into a coma.

posted by deadcowdan 14 November | 15:55

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by sciurus 14 November | 16:03

The rabbit thing is so lame.

posted by y2karl 14 November | 16:14

Dios, shut up.

posted by AlexReynolds 14 November | 16:19

He is a good guy who will be missed if he leaves.

Agreed.

As fas as the referenced thread goes, blech. I don't blame you for wanting to get far away from that one.

The bottom line is: Metafilter is a political site, with all of the hostility and grudge-holding that implies. It's quite obviously what the vast majority of the members -- especially the new members -- sign up for.

No! No! No! Although I agree with the rest of your post I am really tired of seeing this trotted out as if it were true. The vast VAST majority of new members don't say a fucking word over there probably because they are scared off by the bickering of a small but vocal minority of both new AND old members who use Metafilter as a punching bag to work out their issues.

Sorry. Not trying to single you out or anything but I'd be willing to bet that one of the reasons new members don't try harder to speak up is because so many people have already written them off as worthless assholes.

Dios, shut up.

Alex, knock it off. We all know you hate dios but he wasn't doing anything but defending brainwidth.

posted by LeeJay 14 November | 16:29

y2karl, this might help.

posted by agropyron 14 November | 16:30

Go fuck yourselves, stick a hot poker up your collective bums, and shut up. Not necessarily in that order.

posted by danostuporstar 14 November | 16:34

Can I post pictures of prawn?

posted by sciurus 14 November | 16:38

I think that would be a good idea.

posted by LeeJay 14 November | 16:43

The rabbit thing is so lame.
I know you are, but what am I?

posted by muddgirl 14 November | 16:49

The bottom line is: Metafilter is a political site, with all of the hostility and grudge-holding that implies. It's quite obviously what the vast majority of the members -- especially the new members -- sign up for.

No! No! No! Although I agree with the rest of your post I am really tired of seeing this trotted out as if it were true.

It's true enough for me -- your mileage may vary. It's obviously not an explicitly political site. However, it is a de facto political site in that a lot of stuff that gets posted is political, a lot of non-political posts get polluted by politics, and everything else is basically ignored. Even AskMe isn't immune to the political taint -- and it was vociferously defended the one time I complained about it.

Sorry. Not trying to single you out or anything but I'd be willing to bet that one of the reasons new members don't try harder to speak up is because so many people have already written them off as worthless assholes.

Look, we're on the same wavelength here. I was one of the new members, and this basically is why I left -- because Metafilter had no interest in what I was trying to say.

On preview:
≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by With move as the Kimchi the user who knows 14 November | 16:49

It's true enough for me -- your mileage may vary. It's obviously not an explicitly political site. However, it is a de facto political site in that a lot of stuff that gets posted is political, a lot of non-political posts get polluted by politics, and everything else is basically ignored. Even AskMe isn't immune to the political taint -- and it was vociferously defended the one time I complained about it.

No, I agree with you that Metafilter has become, for the most part, a political site with arguing and insults par for the course. What I am disagreeing with is the idea that most new members specifically signed up for that. But as you say, YMMV.

posted by LeeJay 14 November | 16:54

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by killdevil 14 November | 16:55

I still can't quite figure out why it seems like a good idea to rehash the same tired arguments here that are being and have already been rehashed ad nauseum over there. Family vacations must double as truly exquisite exercises in sado-masochism.

posted by Frisbee Girl 14 November | 16:59

Giant squid vs. Super Bunny.

posted by agropyron 14 November | 17:00

I feel like the ratio of rabbit pictures to text posts in this thread should shift from < 1 to > 1.

posted by killdevil 14 November | 17:06

Shrimp pouch rabbits

posted by LeeJay 14 November | 17:08

I am disagreeing with is the idea that most new members specifically signed up for that.

ok, point taken. But I'd wager that only the ones who signed up for that reason (arguing and insults) are getting their money's worth. For the rest of us, there's really not much point.

ok, I think it's time for me to leave Metatalk on Metatalk. And now, especially for y2karl, MORE BUNNIES!

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by With move as the Kimchi the user who knows 14 November | 17:09

MORE BUNNIES! Something we can all get behind. Except for agropyron and y2karl so for them: MORE SQUID!

posted by LeeJay 14 November | 17:21

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by agropyron 14 November | 17:23

I must always remember, He suffered to atone my sin of Metatalking:

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by With move as the Kimchi the user who knows 14 November | 17:30

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by killdevil 14 November | 17:49

Man, who dosed dios with a hit of MDMA? :)

Sense of humor in MeTa, cool FPP in the blue and words of wisdom here. Keep it up, dios.

I'm sorry bunnies, but if I bite my tongue any more I'm going to swallow it. But more bunny pics, please.

Alex, you shut up. Please. It's for your own good. You're only burning bridges left and right and otherwise being incredibly irritating. Stop acting like such a reactionary, hyper-defensive asshole, eh? You may or may not care, but over the last 48 hours or so you've gone from tolerable to unsufferable.

Normally I could give a shit, but damn, man. Take a walk. Go pet a cat or something. Smoke a bowl. Have a glass of wine. SOMETHING. Just get the hell away from the computer already.

Yeah, the Krrrlson callout was pretty damn lame. Your reaction to it only made it worse - it would have been called a lame callout without you having to get all reactionary and defensive about it.

posted by loquacious 14 November | 18:28

The Bunny Christ images are truly beautiful.

posted by agropyron 14 November | 18:29

≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by arse_hat 14 November | 18:56

≡ Click to see image ≡
≡ Click to see image ≡
≡ Click to see image ≡

posted by Edible Energy 14 November | 22:14

I just poked my nose in that thread for a moment, and now I'm sitting here wondering if I got told to fuck off. It's like stepping into an old west saloon in the middle of a shoot-out.

posted by Marxchivist 14 November | 22:55

monju:

Don't go. Goatdog's on the money. Avoid political threads, and avoid MetaTalk like it has the plague, syphillis, avian flu, and chicken pox all rolled into one.

KimChi's got a point: even doing that won't keep you away from all the flying shit; there's always some rebound spatter that hits other random threads. But for some, it's a little enough amount that overall MeFi returns to being an overall positive place, more enjoyable to be at than not the be at. For some others (such as KimChi, whom I also really like), the backspatter is still too much.

So I'd say: give the rollback a try first. Stop going to the grey, stop clicking if you see words like "Rove", "Bush", "Iraq", or the like. If you're still finding MeFi to suck after doing the rollback, then quit. But give the rollback a chance.

posted by bugbread 14 November | 23:22

I'm a relatively new user (1 year) and I don't post as much as I thought I would. I read MeFi for years before being able to join, and I didn't join it thinking it would be the way it is now. I barely read the front page anymore, mostly AskMe. Half of the threads are pissing contests, it's the same shit over and over.

And honestly, what is with all the sock puppets? I can understand having one so that you can ask more sensitive questions without having it connected to your public persona, but I met mathowie at the Toronto meetup last Friday and he told us that he recently found out about a user with FIVE accounts, just for flaming people. That kind of shit just destroys it. Who is so massively invested in MeFi culture that they will invent four new personalities just to piss people off? It baffles me, and makes me not want to play anymore.

I used to like MeFi because it introduced me to eclectic people and their quirky interests every day. I used to learn things. I have to wade through the shit to get to the good stuff now. And I still do learn a ton of stuff from AskMe, and some FPPs. I'm not giving up on it, but I wish I could introduce the site to friends without having to explain that there are so many assholes on the site that sections of it have become almost completely useless. I wish we didn't have threads started by earnest new users that turn into flame-wars because she didn't realise that we couldn't play nice if the topic was fat acceptance. And then the state of the site is blamed on the new users!

I don't even know what would make it better. I think Matt and Jessamyn are put into a tough spot of not wanting to be accused of censorship nor be accused of letting the trolls run the show. No matter what they do, someone's got a beef with it. If they let the problem users stay, things might never change. If they ban them, the shit will hit the fan, and the sock puppets will begin anew.

I wish the answer was to simply make great FPPs. Maybe that's part of the answer, but it doesn't address the part of the problem that is made up of users whose site-personalities have become so important to them that they need to show whose side they're on and flame each other every chance they get. You boys need to simmer down. Get off your computers. Your life is so short, and you are spending it arguing furiously with people on a WEBSITE. This does not MATTER. Go simmer down, and then come back and show me the best of the web.

posted by heatherann 14 November | 23:48

I just poked my nose in that thread for a moment, and now I'm sitting here wondering if I got told to fuck off. It's like stepping into an old west saloon in the middle of a shoot-out.

No, it was directed at one of the usual Metafilter trolls.

posted by AlexReynolds 14 November | 23:56

Heatherann: I agree with almost everything you wrote, except for the very very end: that people shouldn't do things merely because they don't matter. People shouldn't shit on a site because it damages something that was good. They shouldn't shit on a site because it makes a lot of people unhappy. They shouldn't shit on a site for a number of reasons, but "this does not matter" isn't one of them, because by that standard, people shouldn't post the best of the web, or have interesting and informative conversations, because neither of those matters either. But, yeah, other than disagreeing on the reason, we totally agree on the conclusion.

I really think Matt needs to start swinging the deletehammer. Not the banhammer: we have surprisingly few members whose existence itself is anathema to MeFi working well. But we do have a lot of posts that mislead people into thinking that Mefi is meant to be a politics and news site. And I'm thinking FPPs more than comments. If that's what Matt wants, then, yeah, those should stay, and the problem is that MeFi isn't about what I want it to be about, so it's just my own problem. But if Matt, as he has indicated in the past, doesn't want Mefi to be a polinews site, he really needs to nip this now. It's too late to nip it in the bud: the bud has grown into a flower, and the flower has started to open. But he needs to cut off the flower before it polinates and turns what was once a bud into a whole garden of corpse flowers.

I just totally overextended that metaphor.

posted by bugbread 15 November | 00:03

Who is so massively invested in MeFi culture that they will invent four new personalities just to piss people off?
Amateurs - I barely have any personality at all and I manage to piss people off without even trying.

Actually, I tip my hat to anyone who can manage to keep 5 personas going at once and keep everything straight - I have tried being two people at once in IRC a few times and always end up typing in the wrong window or forgetting which person I am at the time. It's bloody hard. I mean, they are stupid twats for doing it, but I admire the ability.

posted by dg 15 November | 00:15

Who is so massively invested in MeFi culture that they will invent four new personalities just to piss people off?

Someone with two accounts here. I only knew about four accounts, though. I wonder who the 5th was. Well, we shall see. It will come out soon enough.

posted by y2karl 15 November | 03:19

...we do have a lot of posts that mislead people into thinking that Mefi is meant to be a politics and news site. And I'm thinking FPPs more than comments. If that's what Matt wants, then, yeah, those should stay, and the problem is that MeFi isn't about what I want it to be about, so it's just my own problem.

I joined MetaFilter on September 18, 2001 after reading an article on Salon about how it was one of a handful of sites to which people were turning for world news. The 9/11 thread was cited. I joined because it was a news site. I found out, however, it was much, much more than that but news has always been a part of the site.

A lot of other people joined the site at the same time as I did for the same reasons I joined and found out the same things I found out. Go back and look at the archives. From 2000, say, there are things like huge fights over Gore v. Nader.

There are more fights now because there are more members. No one knows who anyone is. With anonymity comes a lot more nastiness. It's not the content that is causing the ugliness--it's the people. It's gone from a small town full of familar faces into a larger town full of strangers. Plus we all live in troubled times. That is a fact that is not going to go away. MetaFilter is not some oasis. Turning it into a cutesy pie only groovy links site that it never was is not the answer.

As for You boys need to simmer down. Get off your computers. Your life is so short, and you are spending it arguing furiously with people on a WEBSITE. This does not MATTER. Go simmer down, and then come back and show me the best of the web...

well, Pot to Kettle: You need to simmer down, too, buddy.

It's always so simple when it's someone else's fault. Then it's all black and white and we have simple solutions--better FPPs, get rid of the assholes--for complex unsolvable problems. As to what's a great FPP, who's an asshole--well, I'll be the judge of that ! And for everyone else, too ! It's alwasy so simple when it's simple But it is never simple.

But when it's always the fault of those people over there--well, that is the fact that entitles you to belittle them. It's always those people over there causing all the trouble. Never us. It would be so simple if everyone was one of us.

Everybody has the idea that if only people posted what I am interested in, everything would be heavenly. That is bullshit.

To paraphrase Elvis Costello, 25,000 little Hitlers will fight it out until 24.999 little Hitlers does the other one's will. That is never going to happen.

The groovy it's all about the links past never existed. We live in troubled times. Nothing is simple. There no easy answers. The place is a work in progress. It always was.

It's an experiment in progress in which we have to learn to get along. Not unlike the real world. People change there at MetaFilter, little by little, and backslide often. But if they stick around, the edges tend to come off. Although there are exceptions, people change, and change for the better more often than not. This has been my experience.

posted by y2karl 15 November | 04:43

You know, I've never worried overmuch about metatalk threads -- I'd much rather that those who thrive on fighting got their kicks there. It's more that the stuff eventually migrates to the blue, so that perfectly good threads get hijacked by some personality confict. I'd love to see an armistice day on MeFi, where everyone just agrees to drop their pet personal animus from every shade and just enjoy the place.

Also, I feel like I've gotten more from mefi/mechat then I could ever give back to it: friends, knowledge, creative collaborations and opportunities -- and I am quite sincere in this. We don't live in a big town, and our time-consuming work and projects mean we don't get out much anyway, so I'm deeply grateful for the connections it provides. I've been thinking about it lately, so much so that I tried to make a little mental list of all the people I'm grateful to have met through t/here, and I couldn't hold it all in my head. That's rarely a problem I encounter.

All of which is to say that I'm not giving up on any of it, not yet. The beasts I dislike, I don't feed; I slip up occasionally, we all do, but it's not so hard to avoid shit talking, much less to turn it into a lifestyle. There's still plenty of sweetness there -- look, in the last couple of days I found uncle glendenning's strange little jewel of a site, I learned there are more poems about mushrooms than I'd ever suspected, and some nice people out west whom I don't even know made me feel like the stuff we spend every other hour of our lives on is not a total waste. No lie, the shinola makes the shit all worth it. So don't leave, monju, cause you're one of the many things I like, always have, even your name: monju bosatsu, it's so fun to say, I sometimes do it involuntarily, like a Japanese girl with Tourette's.

posted by melissa may 15 November | 06:11

Heatherann: I agree with almost everything you wrote, except for the very very end: that people shouldn't do things merely because they don't matter. People shouldn't shit on a site because it damages something that was good. They shouldn't shit on a site because it makes a lot of people unhappy. They shouldn't shit on a site for a number of reasons, but "this does not matter" isn't one of them, because by that standard, people shouldn't post the best of the web, or have interesting and informative conversations, because neither of those matters either. But, yeah, other than disagreeing on the reason, we totally agree on the conclusion.

Well, I'm not trying to say that MeFi is completely useless, or that damaging the site doesn't have an effect, or that everything has to have a world-changing effect in order to be worth doing. I'm just saying that in the long run, whether or not people on MeFi like or agree with me is not something I should get worked up about, and I see a lot of people getting really worked up about it, like in the MetaTalk thread linked at the top of this page.

posted by heatherann 15 November | 07:52

if they stick around, the edges tend to come off. Although there are exceptions, people change, and change for the better more often than not. This has been my experience.
Mine also.

Actually, I find that, by almost never reading MeFi (and then never ever ever political stuff) and mostly reading MeTa means that it is easier to laugh at the arguments because they lack context and, therefore, heat. People getting their panties all bunched and then refusing to admit it is funny.

monju bosatsu - don't leave please, because we need all the sane people we can get. If not for you and those like you, then they would win. We can't have that, now can we?

posted by dg 15 November | 08:07

I joined MetaFilter on September 18, 2001 after reading an article on Salon about how it was one of a handful of sites to which people were turning for world news. The 9/11 thread was cited. I joined because it was a news site.

I started reading MeFi well before 9/11 (can't remember when). It sure didn't seem like a news site at the time, though there were occasional news items. It was because of 9/11 (specifically, I'm not thinking of 9/11 itself, but the resultant Afghanistan invasion) that news blossomed so much.

As for anonymity being the cause of the anger/bile, I took time off from even reading MeFi for a while because of all the infighting, and that was during the closed doors period. The opening of the doors to new users didn't increase the amount of shitflinging, it just changed the shit flingers from well-known names to less well-known names. Still, I'd say MeFi is less full of immaturity than it was during the pre-second-election days, for example.

No, MeFi has never been the groovy-link-only paradise some say it was. But it did used to try to be that.

posted by bugbread 15 November | 10:39

y2k,

The above isn't to say that you're wrong. It may just be a matter of perception: To me, before 9/11, MeFi didn't "feel" like a news site, despite having news on it. Starting soon after 9/11, it started to "feel" like a news site, and, coincidentally or noncoincidentally, it started to "feel" less civil. This may have been due a change in the dynamic, or it may have been due to some other external factor that caused my feelings to change. Because they're my feelings, I can't really step out of myself to determine if they're correct or incorrect, because no matter how out of myself I try to step, it's still just into myself. In the same way, if you perceived pre-9/11 MeFi to be a news site, you're not in a position to say for sure whether it was or wasn't. In the end, it really just comes down to the majority "feeling" of people who read MeFi both before and after 9/11, and due to the fact that a lot of people left, it's hard if not impossible to find out, because there may be a bias in the kind of people that stayed, and there might not, and that's pretty hard to objectively decide as well.

posted by bugbread 15 November | 14:50

Yay!

Way to talk brainwidth off the ledge, MeCha.

posted by danostuporstar 18 November | 14:16

14 November 2005