Source Material for Guidelines and Policies

Source material for guidelines and policies:

Pluses/Positive Characterizations

Character of Site:

• Everyone knew each other, everyone was supportive of each other
• Chummy atmosphere
• Small enough that I felt like I could be pretty open about everything that was going on in my life...felt like it was "among friends."
• Primarily social
• Threads like 3-point updates or other personal chatty posts
• We did silly things
• Salon feel of wit and banter and discussion
• Photo Fridays
• Playlist posts
• Homey
• Feel an attachment to the place.
• Peculiar mix of playfulness, earnest dialogue, vociferous debate, and opinion/preference/quirk-sharing
• More than just a website to hang at. It's always been a community
• I love reading about the basic humanity we all share
• The only place I could discuss some things I had, literally, no other arena to discuss.
• The source of the only online friends I've ever found
• MetaFilter is like a huge university campus, MetaChat is the dorm where we all hang out after class
• Love the chatty aspect of this site; it's impossible to reproduce it on Facebook...that's not a discussion.
• It's dropping in visiting with friends.
• A valuable and fun adjunct to Metafilter.
• The most fun threads are those that encourage participation from newbies. I loved the "questions you dare not ask at askme", the "delurk!" threads, and the "say hi, new members!" threads.
• [Strength of] MetaChat is that it isn't interest-oriented. It's primarily social. It exists for no other reason than discussion and making connections and being playful with one another
• People describe Metachat as "friendly", which I think is almost true but not quite- it's more a place for friends. A place to make friends, to keep in touch with friends
• You can lurk, participate a little, or participate a lot
• While there are plenty of light and silly posts on MetaChat, the format allows you to do in-depth posts as well
• I still enjoy seeing new faces, hearing about people's lives and opinions
• It's like a little internet-neighborhood party where there are always a few (or a great many) people chit-chatting away.
• Like a never-ending PJ party
• I like the quiet, the absence of GRAR HATE GRAR METARIOT ANGRY GRAR issues and grudges; its like a pleasant walk in the woods some days
• Critter pics, shared feeling about job loss issues, talk about neighborhoods I'll probably never see, etc
• It's so low-key around here, and I can read through everything
• Nice and flexible playground
• Good issue-related debate
• Salon feel of wit and banter and discussion
• Most of the real-life friends I have these days are people I met through MetaChat.
• The only online forum where I've ever felt really at home.
• MOD - it was never our intention to do pruning-type moderation in effort of encouraging the quality
• Some really awesome, deep discussions
• Like being at summer camp and just having a huge intense conversation late into the *night
• People take a personal interest in the dailiness of one anothers' lives.
• MeCha was (and still is, probably) a *great* place to make friends
• This site reminds me of something I loved about living in NYC. Sometimes at night I'd be riding the bus and when it went past apartment buildings, I'd often catch a glimpse inside a lighted window...I got a peek into someone else's life.
• At once intimate and anonymous
• I like the sense of community
• I like checking in and seeing what everyone's doing.
• I feel like you're my neighbors
• I realized that what felt so closed-off to me was really just a tightly-knit community with a lot of friendly jokes and backstory
• It feels like neighbors who you only see in tiny glimpses at the mailbox or on the stoop... and then one day at the block party, I opened up and discovered how much we have in common and how congenial we are
• I like the quirkiness and the lovely little vignettes people often share
• I eventually saw the occasional censure of obnoxiousness as the germination of a community
• I have offered my own advice for people I felt that advice could help
• A lot of people get support here

Bad Stuff/Negative Characterizations

• Drama fests
• I like the sharp edges sometimes - too much "OMG! this" and "3-point that" just makes the site static, predictable and altogether too squishy-safe
• Touchy-squishy Hallmark vibe.
• Sometimes, this place is just too nice and we have always had trouble getting that happy medium between happy-happy-joy-joy and total GRAR
• Many seem to be seeking an echo chamber rather than a thoughtful, honest discussion
• I miss the sparkier threads of old where there'd be genuine back-and-forth debate and argument, and sometimes vociferous disagreement
• Everything is not okay. Some things need more help than they can get from any amount of cyber handholding and pictures of kittens and eventually that mindset got to me.
• Always got the feeling that I was not "one of you"
• Felt invisible and lost interest
• It would be hard for someone new to really feel accepted because it's a very clubby sort of place where you need to know people and the history of the community to really be able to relate properly.
• It seemed as if while there was a balance between support and conversation and fun once, eventually that balance got subsumed
• I just don't have it in me to be constantly offering support.
• I got tired of people who never contribute anything to the site, neither goofy pictures nor news of the weird nor even chatty contributions to three-point threads, showing up and needing a hug and handholding and all the rest.
• [high expectations for welcome, support, attention] How many of those expectations are stated or suggested by the environment, but not fulfilled?
• There aren't new people coming in and without them, it cannot last
• It could be intimidating for a newcomer
• There is some inside baseball when we talk together, and it takes a while to get caught up
• The clubby/clique-y is pretty easy for me to see, as a relative outsider
• It often feels like I'm crashing a party and am tolerated but not especially welcome
• Many of the more provocative posters either were frozen out or drifted off
• I always tend towards NOT contacting mods, because I don't like to bother people.
• Why is it bad for users to address issues themselves? I don't think it is, if everyone does their best to not go too crazy or pile-on.
• No one ever told the users what constitutes an appropriate reason to ask for moderator action, beyond "If you see a post or comment that you think should be deleted or edited then e-mail the mods and they'll deal with it."
• What do I do if someone uses hate speech that targets me or my friends?
• What do I do if someone expresses that they think my lifestyle is perverse, then blows up when I call them out on that belief?
• What do I do if I feel like another user is "thread-stalking" me (ie, looking specifically for comments I post so that they can specifically rebut them, or so they can throw previously-held opinions back at me)?
• What if someone is acting really oddly and it seems like they are doing so intentionally?
• What do I do if another poster is belittling me, or accusing me of "blowing things out of proportion" and just generally refusing to move on to another thread?
• By far most of the leavings seem to have come about when people have felt pushed out by the collective will
• Someone that deliberately provokes and says hateful things for attention, and lashing out when they don't stop after being asked to do so
• The 'nice' vibe here creates its own problem, because it's hard to reconcile that with any sort of disagreement and comments disagreeing with someone that wouldn't raise an eyebrow somewhere like MeTa seem to be considered as the most heinous behaviour here.
• I would like the discussion here to be more robust, but we seem to really struggle to find that middle ground where robust discussion happens with the level of respect needed to stop it turning into a shit-fight.
• We're pretty good at agreeing, but we suck a bit at disagreeing, for some reason.
• Some people wanted things to stay chatty, some wanted to have more deep discussions and, as a group, we failed to reconcile those conflicting needs
• When there's just some weird thing among members, some angry dynamic that gets nasty, and it's a no-win situation
• Mods were operating on their own, trying to make their own decisions, and not always feeling they had a structure to rely on that gave the confidence and ability to moderate with greater consistency
• Mod presence became less visible
• Things didn't have to descend so far into the nastiness
• In the absence of any community standards specified and enforced by the moderators, the most prolific and most personable users of the site determined their own standards and enforced them through various methods.

Comments on User and Moderation Environment

• As a user community, we defaulted to an 'anything goes' philosophy
• Moderators, because they are people and busy or because they want to remain behind-the-scenes, rarely seem to step in and use their moderator hat in-thread even if it's just saying "Stop doing this", which gives users the impression that, if we don't like something, we're on our own
• On one hand we don't want cabals or cliques, but on the other hand no one wants to do anything to stop cliquey behavior
• MOD -There was a desire to be free-form, but that meant that we couldn't agree on what made an allowable or non-allowable post or comment or bit of site-related behavior.
• MOD - back-channel action that gets people riled up.
• MOD - mail threatening that unless X-member is banned, then Y-member is leaving and/or because X-member was given a time-out Z-member is leaving
• MOD - if you want a site with only your BFFs commenting/posting, you should make a site like that, invitation-only
• MOD - in most of the cases where things blew up, it would have been simpler and wiser for a lot of people to have ignored certain posts. But, apparently, people really, really wanted to collectively lose it, and that's the very worst thing because there isn't any solution.
• MOD - Sometimes it is a question of trolling behavior... is it or isn't it? That's often a tough call,
• MOD - close things up and the brawl will spring up elsewhere, plus many people will be angry about shutting down the "conversation." Let it go, and people will be angry about the lack of oversight. Ban, don't ban, a bunch of people will be angry.
• MOD - This place has always been more hands-off than intervention oriented, which also means that there aren't historical standards for dealing with things, so when there is a mod action, this is also seen as being a big deal, and some indication of the "way the site is going," when it's pretty much always just someone trying to choose the least worst from among a lot of uncomfortable options
• For a long time I found it annoying when other users would tell me that something I said wasn't kosher here
• MOD - [bad] stuff started happening right out of the gate.
• MOD - almost immediately there were email complaints that were basically threats or ultimatums about leaving because of this person or that person, and they had nothing to do with either of you.
• MOD - the toughest is when you really don't know where to draw the line, don't know if you have any support, don't have any guidelines to refer to, don't have community consensus, and don't have a good way to justify your action or non-action to people who inquire
• MOD - I've banned people for writing stalker-type emails to other members, posting fake links that go to hardcore porn, and for having a fake email addy in their profile so we could not contact them about an issue
• MOD - When people bring up someone's bad behaviour we have tried to address it in a timely fashion with direct contact with the accused and with a minimum of public show
• MOD - People have, on quite a few occasions, put the moderators in an impossible situation by complaining that someone is being mean, then complaining when something was done about it (sometimes the same people!) because the action taken wasn't exactly what you wanted

Recommendations and Suggestions

• Some people are complaining that the site is too schmoopy while at the same time others are complaining it's too hostile. This is a fight with no winners, trust me. Everyone here has the option of making it more of what they like
• If you want it to be open for a lot of different things, then you need to be active in promoting those things that you enjoy
• Positive energy in, positive energy out, I think.
• It's okay to be passive when that's your mood, but not everyone can be passive and expect things to be fun and lively
• To have a community where deep feelings of belonging and positive connection are genuine, you also have to leave open the possibility of antagonism and people who you find difficult to deal with -- neuter one and you neuter the other?
• An interesting world is made up of more than the people you love
• I like the sharp edges sometimes - too much of the opposite makes the site static, predictable and altogether too squishy-safe
• More robust discussion to compel people to hang around and participate about things that matter
• Whatever the site becomes, it needs to maintain an element of humanity, a sense that members can come to share their joys and pains and questions and answers
• We're all here of our own free will. It's opt-in.
• All members will be welcome as long as they evidence a desire to contribute respectfully to the community, are responsive to moderation, and give as much support as they get
• Not being obnoxious goes a long way. One of the quotes I swear by is "Respect the dignity of every human being."
• Be careful about setting standards that you aren't prepared to adhere to yourself
• Everyone here *is* open and welcoming to folks who put a little effort into participating.
• A newcomer needs to build a wee bit of "conversational equity" - Make a few chat deposits in your account before trying to withdraw some emotional support
• Many members enjoy interacting daily or weekly and might seem to know one another well. Don't mistake this for exclusiveness; just jump in
• People arrive at different times, and are somewhat unknown until they indicate a bit about themselves...facilitate this process
• New member intake could be an area we can work on
• One thing we could look at is sort of new user intake
• Creating a New User Welcome Tradition
• Outreach campaign where we each invite a couple of new people personally to come over to MetaChat for fun times
• Have an abundance of those low-intimidation-threshold threads which make it really clear that everybody is not only invited and welcome to, but actually expected to, respond: the "three-point status," the "what'd you have for lunch,", the "[conversation opening question]", the "what kind of shoes are you wearing"
• A healthy cycle of incoming users on a relatively continuous basis
• We could use some new folks
• Attract & encourage folks to stick around long enough to find out that they truly are welcome.
• When a new member joins, there needs to be a "hurrah" moment - like a "Welcome to our newest member, DeputyDawg" in the site header or something, welcoming them. There could be a "new members this week - every one throw an egg at em" area on the sidebar
• New users could be made to feel more welcome by having more overt "welcome new member" rituals and structures
• Be really welcoming to newbies. REALLY welcoming, asking for participation
• No more clubby, no more clique-y
• Much longer front page, things disappear too quickly.
• If not a longer front page, at least a "Older Posts" link at the bottom of the page.
• Favorites and tags
• I'd like to see favorites and tags. It's hard to find stuff or remember stuff
• Some sort of bookmarking function
• Change pictures more often
• Bring back the alien
• Stuff like Photo Fridays is important for site cohesion, IMO. It gives structure to the site beyond complete chatting/hanging out
• Have some equivalent of the Recent Twitters by MeFites page
• Use a back end that facilitates site messaging and collaborative modding
• MOD - Everyone needs to be much less precious about their feelings being hurt...Everyone is entitled to their views and opinions, even if they are dark and scary. Everyone is entitled to be treated like a human being, even if you loath them and every word out of their mouth makes you want to puke
• MOD - make banning and timeouts as absolutely minimal as possible. My preferred standards are time-outs for when people get OCD flooding the threads with comments because they are not in a good mental place, so every single post becomes dominated by them, situations where people are really lashing out or losing it because of personal problems, drubk posting... that kind of thing. Banning for trollig
• Focus on the creative, the fun, and the helpful. Foster discussions. Polls are fun when they're not facebooky.
• Focus on the community aspect of the site, not on moderation. We members should see mods as enforcers, facilitators and goto folk for problems, not babysitters
• I don't think it functions so well as a standalone (w/o connection to MetaFilter) and I'd like to see the two sites move closer again
• Encouraging people to post the stuff here that they can't or don't want to post at MetaFilter is one way of drawing in new users
• It was an ongoing mistake not to continue actively recruiting new people after the initial May 2005 push with regular MeTa threads
• You need new people, totally new people, fun new people with fun new things to say.
• Backchannel bullshit shouldn't be tolerated from members.
• Members who, for whatever reason, publicly shame or shun other members: It should not be allowed here. Ever. Not in an overt way. And not in a passive-aggressive way, either
• A set of guidelines
• Clear member rules, clearly stated, and enforced
• The site rules and mission statement and even a subtle banner should be very clear that public "fighting" or shunning will not be tolerated
• There should be ample opportunity for members to report problems to moderators, rather than airing grievances in public
• Mods should be rotated and have clear responsibilities that are well known to the members
• Mods should be badged, or identifiable in some way
• Clear indication, via non-subtle "having a problem with a thread, comment, member, or the site? Report it here!" type links, to encourage the reporting member to take the problem off the public side of the site
• I like rule #1: Don't be a d*ck. I think rule #2 should be: "If you think a member doesn't belong here because they don't 'fit', quietly inform a moderator, and be ready to back up your words."
• I'm all in favor of the notion that having rule number one be "Don't be an arse/ass/dick/cunt (did I get every possible permutation?)" be implemented
• MOD - I'm in favour of the 'don't be an arsehole' approach rather than documented rules, because setting rules means you have to defend them when different interpretations are brought into play.I'd rather see a set of broad guidelines written up that say 'don't be an arsehole' in several bullet points and leave it to the moderation team to have the right combination of common sense and hard-headedness to apply them fairly and then stick to their decisions. The last bullet point in that list should be 'moderator decisions are final and will not be debated publicly, but feel free to e-mail your concerns'
• Basically, enforce the rules, whatever they are. Enforce them in a way that makes it clear there are rules. Because otherwise we have the ...situation..., where everyone acts how they want, and 10% are yelled at for it until they leave and 90% get away with it and stay, repeat and repeat and repeat
• MOD - If I drop into a thread and tell people to pull their heads in and anyone continues to taunt, poke, prod or otherwise goad someone into continuing, they can expect to be treated the same way as the perpetrator, without fear or favour.
• MOD - If someone is either deliberately baiting you, or is refusing to engage in debate, but continues to blurt out their opinion without engaging in the discussion, stop engaging!
• If the rule is (as has been suggested) "don't be a jerk", then I feel like moderators have a responsibility to step in and tell people, in-thread, that they are being a jerk and that further jerkiness will result in a time-out or some other punitive measure
• The applicable question there has to be "What's best for the site's health, now and in the future?"
• If the rule is (and this is from the FAQ) "Metachat's policy is so loose that no user should ever feel the need to admonish another user for not meeting the guidelines", then I feel like moderators have a responsibility to post in-thread and stop the people who are admonishing another user for not meeting the guidelines
• There's appropriate participation, which sadly sometimes includes times when each of us will feel unsupported by others and butt heads with other people, and there's inappropriate participation, which will draw large amounts of objection
• MOD - asshole behavior needs to be shut down, but here's where we diverge: If a member IS being a huge dick, it's on the community NOT to engage at that level. Do NOT pile on. Do NOT engage if you are not directly involved. Stay out of it. Notify a moderator. Let the mods sort it
• Need a sense of structure and social order
• MOD - Posts or comments come down when, in the judgment of the moderators,they are flagrant and knowing violations of standards, when they are badly thought-out but mostly innocent mistakes by a user, when a critical mass of users has made objection, and when the mod's experience of the user's history gives some context for managing that user.

It's not just about deleting clearly problematic comments and posts. It's also about nipping problematic comments in the bud by setting clearly-enforced and non-biased standards of conduct

• There needs to be some trust that the mods are dealing with things in the best way they can and the understanding that, if you have a problem with someone else, it isn't always them that is causing the problem - it is possible that your expectations are unrealistic