(sorry, I mucked up the "Read more-->" bit, but here's my more anyway:)

The question is mostly, if the sound of it really really bothered me, would there be any recourse? I mean, kids play in their yards, why should they stop if I'm a curmudgeon? But don't I get to enjoy my yard too? Chalk this up to random chattiness, I suppose, as there isn't a problem here.

A person's behavior on their property is only limited when it is outside of legal norms. I couldn't operate a wood chipper 24 hours a day, it violates ordinances, but I could do it for a reasonable amount of time. Children playing and laughing in their yards is reasonable. Most places take private property rights very seriously and will only infringe upon them in extreme conditions.

Is there such a term as legal norms? I don't think so, but you get what I mean.

A certain amount of noise tolerance is part of living in a neighborhood, for better or worse, but there is a line. Kids have the right to be kids and play outside, yeah, but if they were going really nuts and shrieking their heads off and running amok you'd be well within your rights to ask their parents to please have them keep it to a dull roar.

Also, during daylight hours, unless you have special needs (like you work the night shift or have someone there under hospice care or a newborn or something), my opinion is that all bets are off noise-wise. Mowers, leaf-blowers, guys working on their motorcycles, and kids playing are a part of the deal, and the best thing you can do is thank whatever that you're not in an apartment with a douchebag next door blaring his stereo at two in the morning.

And I say that as someone who is beginning the process of getting his house ready to sell so that we can once and for all be done with the noisy, messy, lazy, passive-aggressive shitbags next door.

On preview, as far as recourse goes, you can (and should) talk to the parents about it. But that's pretty much it. No cop or judge is going to side with you against children having fun in their own yard unless they're really creating some kind of nuisance.

You simply yell, "You kids, get off your lawn!"

Once when I was on a bicycle tour I was kept up far later then I wanted by kids running around screaming to all hours. I was reading a collection of Bashō on that tour and this haiku summed it all up for me. Perhaps is apropos here:

For those who proclaim
They've grown weary of children,
There are no flowers.
- Matsuo Bashō

I must admit though when the kids are totally out of control somewhere particularly inappropriate it seems like there are no flowers....

If you hate the sound of children laughing, you have to file your taxes on form 1040A instead of 1040EZ. You may also have to pay the Alternative Minimum Tax, but I'm not sure so check with your accountant.

No recourse for reasonable noise at reasonable hours (I think that's 8 a.m. to 11 p.m. in my town).

My suggestion is to wear headphones and crank some tunes. Or, to fight fire with fire, skip the headphones.

Let the children's laughter remind us how we used to be...

/whitneyhouston

Precisely, amyms! I may not want to be reminded of how I used to be :)

Anyways, they seem to be having a good time. And I was treated to an excellent teachable moment (below), so they will not be told to get off their lawn ~just~ yet.

**general crying and mayhem**
mom: what happened here?
crying kid (ck): she was having fun but it wasn't fun!
having fun but not being fun kid (hfbnbfk): it was okay!
[repeat last two lines, 3x]
mom: come here, now, you say "I don't like it when..." what didn't you like?
ck: she didn't stop.
mom: okay, "You don't like it when she doesn't stop when you're not having fun."?
ck: ~mumble~ yea, she...
hfbnbfk: but it was...
mom: wait, you say "I'm sorry that I...."
hfbnfk: ~mumble~ "I'm sorry you weren't fun and I didn't stop"
dad: are we done with the pool now?

I'm sure a lot is being lost between the fence and statistics on the page, but that's the gist of it... what did we learn? When we don't say what mom wants the pool gets put away.

Is there such a term as legal norms? I don't think so, but you get what I mean.

Yes, but lawyers call it "reasonable or necessary", or something along those lines. You might see "usual" (or conversely "unusual").

I have to say my niece is on a bit of a manic roll lately and has been running around and shrieking like a banshee for no apparent reason. I feel like calling the cops on us.

When we don't say what mom wants the pool gets put away.

Damn right!

(actually it sounds like the mom was doing a good job of trying to teach the kids how to constructively express themselves and how to resolve conflict, which should serve them well later in life even if it makes no sense as a child when it's so much easier and more cathartic to fuss)

Yea, amyms, I think you're right, but I kept going back to the last fight I had with my other bit and it took way more than mouthing the right words to sort it out (we're both a little bit too 'clever' than we should be about using non-fighting language in a fighty way) and wondering if it's even possible to get kids to break it all down in a way that allows them to walk away and have fun again soon.

Which is about when I realise that I'm not really good for child bearing yet.

wondering if it's even possible to get kids to break it all down in a way that allows them to walk away and have fun again soon

Kids have always been pretty good at navigating between fighting and having fun again... I remember several conflicts with my friends from early childhood that all seemed to be some variation of:

"I hate you!"

"I hate you too!"

[simmer and pout for a few minutes]

"Wanna play Barbies?"

"Okay!"

In kindergarten I was invited, with everyone in the class, to the birthday party of Simon, my designated enemy. simon wasn't a bad kid, but for some reason we were on opposite sides in some kind of amorphous conflict.

I wrote on the very nice card purchased by my mom:

DEAR SIMON,

I HATE YOU BUT HAPPY BIRTHDAY ANYWAY.

Saving that for future Metachat birthday threads :D

Here is what I'd do. If it was a real problem for you, go and stand by the fence, on your own property, and scream and scowl. "Shut up! Fer Chrissakes, shut up! You are driving me MAAD!" Continue until they shut up.

If they're within their rights to disturb your peace, well then so are you.

I've twice live right beside schools, each of which offered its audio gifts of hordes of screamingbatshitinsane subadults nine months out of the year. But I became used to that. I've also lived next to clubs with electronic music (really loud), clubs with live music, amplified (really loud), clubs with live music, unamplified (still, surprisingly loud), blah, blah. I became used to all that, and miss it all (to some degree) still.

I now live in an incredibly quiet place, which is - unbelievably and unaccountably, in the center of one of the noisiest, craziest urban centers in the entire world - almost silent, as though it were 30 years ago. Except for (occasional) dogs barking, it's one of the most quiet places I've ever experienced... And seriously, when we first moved here I quite distressed by the quiet - the odd, unquiet quiet; it had a frightening "dead" feeling to me, though our neighborhood is quite quaint and delightful otherwise. Now I'm used to the almost unnatural quiet, and it feels completely comfortable.

... which means, oh, shit! ... Now I'm going to become a fucking bitch about noise, just like the other crazy people who don't understand about living in the city.

We'll see.

I love it here, though. And so do V. & Sky.