I hate to be a worry wart, but first (if it were me) I would check to see if it was lead-based paint, and asbestos-containing plaster.

The lead issue, you can buy a pack of swabs, and follow the directions. . .the plaster, well, how old is it?

When you say "stucco" are you talking about the spray on ceiling texture stuff (commonly used in the 70's)? If so, I think you have to remove that, you can't paint over it.

There are sprays you can use to "re-popcorn" the ceiling if you don't want to paint it. Does it need painting (i.e. is it discolored?) Or would just taping/puttying the cracks and then spraying popcorn on it work?

Do you have pics? Is the trim wood (hopefully) or plaster (oh nos!)
Either the ceiling is plaster on lath with real stucco-texture or it's a gypsum board with the texture applied. The moulding is installed after the ceiling if it’s a gypsum ceiling and the texture is more easily removed without impacting the trim. If it’s a real plaster ceiling, you will have to be very careful to not have the whole thing come down.

Your description makes me think it's plaster...

Yeah, pics would be great--if you can post some, I can see what I or my boss can tell you (he's also a skilled plasterer). I'm with mightshould--praying it's spraytex, thinking it's not. But as I said, I'd be happy to print out any pics you can post and show 'em to the boss-man tomorrow.

I know the walls are plaster... which probably means the ceiling is plaster too, right?

I don't have a digital camera, so it's really not that easy for me to get pictures to post.

The ceiling really could use a coat of fresh paint.

If it's plaster, does that mean I have to scrape it all off [bangs head repeatedly against keyboard] and then spray on a new ceiling and buy new mouldings [more head banging]?

Hmmmm...Okay, what's the texture like? Is it swoopy, old fashioned cake-icing like or more fine than that? Also, how big are the cracks?

(You don't want to re-apply spray ceiling. Really. Partly because it's messy and partly because, well, why?)

It's like they mixed sand in with the paint. Well, it's somewhat coarser than sand.

Hrm. Well, that *sounds* like it might be spraytex, in which case you should be able to remove it pretty easily, patch the drywall behind it and the cracks or re-drywall the whole thing, prime and paint the ceiling, with a flat non-textured result, without destroying the ceiling rosettes (or maybe remove them and put them back up once the ceiling repair is done). If you were on the wet coast I'd come over with a friend and advise you or lend you my camera or something, but all I can say is that it may not be as bad as you feared, and to show it to someone who knows wtf they're dealing with. In a case like this, in other words, I'd call in the pros, at least for an assessment.

You may have to just "dig in" and see what you're dealing with. Do some investigation.

If there is an overhead light fixture, or anything else like that, try removing it so you can see above the ceiling. If there's nothing in that particular room, there may be something removable in another similar room.

If that's not a go, then you may have to do "destructive" testing: Take a small out of the way area and spray water on it. Wait just a little and try scraping off the texture with something flat, maybe a putty knife. If it comes off easily, Yippee!!!

The other option is to take a sharp knife and dig into it to see if you can ream out a hole large enough to tell. This can be repaired later.

Right up my alley this kind of work.
Don't be wetting it down though, whoa./

Yes, the ceiling is lathe and plaster, like the walls [you said 30 years old...].

You'll have to scrape along the lines [cracks], cleaning them out. Instrument of choice is the 5 in 1 paint scraper. Some are larger called 9 in 1's.
Is the ceiling bouncy [gives] when you push your hand into the ceiling along the cracks¿
If yes,
You'll need to secure the bouncy ceiling down first, drilling drywall screws [2-1/2", course thread] into it, beside the crack and all alongside of it, both sides. Preferrably out to where it doesn't give any more. Find the lathe behind it, you'll know when the screws don't catch, they just go in too easily. Do this before repairing the cracks [otherwise all your fresh plastering will crack again].

While scraping out the cracks, look out, things could be really loose and fall. Depending how bad it is.
If the ceiling isn't springy and doesn't give, you're in luck.

If the crack is hairline-ish, you could use plaster of paris and add sand to imitate ceiling finish. First mix plaster, then add sand. Add water if too thick. If it's the original ceiling, this is how it was done. Don't mix more than you can spread because it sets up quickly [hardens].

Modern Day Method:
Use Durabond [LePage product] to plaster the crack. You've scraped the actual crack using the pointy end of the 5in1, now use the sharp flat blade and scrape along the crack, scraping any loose popcorn plaster around it.
Durabond is very tough, just mix with water to a buttery, spreadable consistency and plaster over that crack. Don't mix all of the 2kg box. Say 3 cups of the dry durabond at a time. Add water and work out the lumps. It will set and harden [rock solid] if you've mixed too much or are plastering too slowly.
Work the durabond into the crack sideways first, then smooth it out lengthwise along the crack. The smoother the better. Make sure it covers the crack. You don't want to be able to see the crack through the durabond. That means it's applied too thinly. Try not to leave high edges along that crackline. Feather the edges, technically. Take the plastering knife [applicator, 4-5" wide and flexible] and after going down the middle of the crack, go over it alongside the edges, flattening them out, but not touching the centre. Both sides.

If you scrape the cracks and plaster falls a lot where you have holes instead of a crack, you'll need to tape it first. Use Fibatape, a white mesh that is 2-3" wide, comes in a roll and is sticky one side. Lay that along the entire length of damaged crack, then apply durabond over it, lengthwise.

Tip:
Keep that plastering knife clean. Keep a bucket of water handy with a rag and wash often, before each fresh application. NEVER in your sink.///

WARNING: Don't pour this stuff down the sink. It'll harden and clog your pipes.
To empty that bucket, pour carefully the water into your toilet, flush. Once you get to the plaster lumps at the bottom, dump into the garbage can.

After it dries, use 60 or 80 grit sandpaper and smooth it down a bit. Then you apply the popcorn plaster, available premixed in a tub. It's available in various coarsenesses, choose one similar to yours, apply it over your durabond fixup, overlapping into the original finish.

Once it's dry, you'll need to paint the ceiling, because it'll be really white. If your ceiling hasn't been painted lately or in ages, you'll have to use an Oil based [Alkyde] Primer. Cover everything with plastic, because that popcorn plaster will be shedding, wear safety glasses and a hat. Then you can finish off your ceiling to your desired colour with a Latex [water] based paint over top the oil primer.

As for your mouldings around the lights, same scraping and cleaning out the cracks. This time, use sheetrock [CGC] plaster. It's soft and easy to sand and form. Apply into cracks and cover smoothly over or press into shape. Don't mix it too runny. Let dry and sand into shape [100 Grit]. To paint, primer first, then top coat.

Yes, it is a lot of work and messy. Cover everything with plastic. How handy are you.
Good luck.///

I'm actually thinking now this is a spray-on stucco. This stucco is in quite a few different rooms: the living/dining room, both upper and lower hallways, two of the bedrooms, and the finished attic. When I was painting my bedroom and got a dab of the pale peach paint on the white stuccoed ceiling (which I did not redo as it was in near perfect condition), I would wipe the peach off with a paint rag, and no matter how gentle I was a little of the stucco would come off, leaving a tiny bald patch. Also, last night I was noticing that the light fixture in the upper hallway has stucco on its base - whoever did the ceiling didn't bother to take down the light fixture first. Wouldn't this mean the ceiling is that spray-on stucco?

Yeah, talked to my boss and he agreed it sounded like spraytex stuff. Here's what he told me:

If it's crumbling off when you rub it, it means they didn't paint it when they applied it, so it wasn't sealed and will come off in crumbly bits onto your roller if you try to paint it. This means that to repair the cracks you'll have to take it off the whole ceiling, but it should come off easily. So: get that stuff off (a wide mudding/putty knife should do it), repair any cracks in the underlying ceiling (we use drywall mud for this) BUT don't bother sanding. Modern patching compounds are harder than plaster, so it's pretty much impossible to do a nice patch job--you end up sanding down the plaster around the patch faster than the patch. Paint it, then once the paint is dry, apply a new layer of spraytex. Tape off/cover EVERYTHING when you do this--the lovely mouldings, the walls, the floor, your neighbour's cat, everything in that room. When you mix up the texture coating, instead of water use a mixture of 60% water to 40% latex paint. This will help to bind the mixture better and you won't end up with that crumbling problem in future. When it's dry, paint it. Voila!

Good luck, Orange Swan! I'm sure it'll look beautiful when it's done.

I'm sure it'll look beautiful when it's done.

It had better, because this sounds like a hideous job. And I must redo the ceilings in the lower hall and other bedroom as well. [whimpers]

But thanks everyone for the advice — you've been a wonderful help.

You've certainly got your work cut out for you, Orange Swan. Do it before the heat/humidity of the summer — it'll take ages for plaster to dry and you'll be sitting there watching it dry.//
TIP: get a fan on the fresh plaster and it'll dry quicker.

NOTE: If you plaster with drywall mud/sheetrock and the hole is too deep, it'll crack when dry. That's why you fibatape a deep crevice and holes and apply plaster over it. The tape also flexes and that stops the new plaster from popping off or cracking again [the science behind the reason].


Your stucco will come off if you paint it with Latex. It will peel right off. That's why you prime it with an oil based Alkyde paint firstly. Some will rain down, but won't peel off.

Fresh stucco is rarely painted afterwards let alone adding latex to the hopper while stuccoing. The developer or builder are saving money...that's why the first time you paint stucco, use an oil based Primer paint. Afterwards you can apply Latex paint.

!You do not have to strip all the stucco off the ceiling to fix a crack. Take off what comes off in the surrounding crack area. You'll be reapplying it in the end.

Using drywall mud will 'fix' the crack temporarily. Hiding it is what you'd be doing. Due to temperature and humidity changes in the house, the lathe contracts and expands [yes, behind that plaster also]. The wood [lathe] really dries out eventually and the plaster separates. That's when it cracks, sags and becomes springy.
Taping [fibatape] the crack + using a hard plaster [durabond] prevents it from cracking there again. Don't forget to secure sagging plaster with drywall screws. If you just use durabond it may hold longer, but not at all with regular mud. First temperature/humidity change or slamming door and that crack reappears.//

If you're going to be spending time fixing something in your home, doing it once, right, is better than continually fixing something or covering it with more stucco and calling the job done. It's your investment, save time, do it once, do it right [ask Holmes on Homes]. :)

Modern patching compounds are harder than plaster, so it's pretty much impossible to do a nice patch job--you end up sanding down the plaster around the patch faster than the patch.—elizard

Not true, elizard. CGC drywall compound/mud/sheetrock is soft therefore easily sandable [and messy], like drywall and plaster; durabond is very hard. It takes skill, plastering application repair know how [I use a 14"X4" trowel] and experience. The durabond is very hard, but you skim coat it [apply in layers, thinly if you're new at this - let dry completely before adding another layer]. You feather the edges, you apply stucco and feather it also. You won't see the repair. My clients attest to my plastering skills - they refer me to more clients.

Speaking as a pro in commercial, residential and staging homes painting and a scenic artist for the film industry for over 10 years.

*shrugs* I've got no dog in this--just repeating my boss's advice (as I've never done it). He's got years of experience as well, but who knows? You may well be right. Sorry if the advice he gave might lead you astray, OS. This is why you're probably best off getting someone who knows (maybe even alicesshoe if he/she's in TO) to come over and look at it.

Okay, I'm confused about this process. But after reading alicesshoe's last comment three times I think I'm starting to see the light. I'm especially happy to hear that although repairing the cracks will be a longish process, I won't have to take down all the stucco. Anything sounds better than taking down that stucco, including pulling out my eyelashes one by one.

I shall ask the Home Depot associates for help in picking out the right products for repairing and priming and painting so I won't go too far wrong.

Thanks all!

Not to slag you elizard, just wanted to stop Orange Swan from doing unnecessary work. I don't have a web site handy of the steps involved, but there must be an accurate one somewhere.

The only before and after photo's I have handy was a cedar deck, which I persuaded the owner to go green, no varnish just washed it, let it dry and used Hemp Oil. Beautiful finish that made the wood glow and incredibly water repellant. Easy maintenance.


It's true Orange Swan, the film industry crapped out here some time ago, so I went the commercial residential route. I painted Ken Thomson's home [RIP of Globe Media — who donated millions of his paintings [Group of Seven's] to AGO — saw a pencil sketch by Durer — holy cow, the art was amazing, nice tour]. I aged a newly built laundry chute cupboard to match existing surrounding cupboards amongst other duties.

Staging homes for resale, most just want to pretty the place up. So one doesn't go crazy with large labour costs. If someone wants to repair their home and keep it, they don't want to return to the project again shortly. I always let people know the options, no filler.

I am in TO and I can give you references of those clients I mentioned and if you'd like, I can pop in and give you the low down on your ceilings.

What shape the cracks are in depends on what you need to buy, even though supplies are the least of the cost.

I'm off to check out some plastering/painting to do on Thursday [a previous satisfied client, seriously] and can take photos and give you a step by step procedure once I start. Probably next Monday.

I didn't get a painting contract [same client I'm seeing Thursday] and lost to College Pro painters. 2 weeks later they called me in to fix the mess — oh my. Unsupervised students slopped oil paint on their freshly sandblasted brick wall on the front porch. That wasn't what they wanted fixed, if you can imagine.

Heh. Maybe I should've apprenticed under you instead.

In his defence, I think that he was trying to offer a solution that a person of reasonable DIY skill and patience could do themselves. I also think he was going with the idea that it sounded like it's that spray-on texture stuff that started to become popular in the 70's, which is, I believe, a different animal than actual stucco (hence also, I think, the paint-adding). I do know that the only reason he said to scrape the ceiling is because the stuff is crumbling when our lovely Swan runs her hand over it, so if it is spraytex it's going to be a horrible, labour-intensive job to patch, and may turn out badly. If it wasn't doing that, he would've said how to patch it and feather in the texture around the cracks. However, you've obviously got a lot of experience working on houses in TO, so would know more about what materials they're likely to have used.

In sympathy--argh! Sloppy, sloppy painters! They drive me mad. (Here it's usually all over cedar beams & posts or tongue in groove wood ceilings, like in my cabin, which I swear was painted by a monkey on crystal meth who'd never heard of a sanding sponge.) Yep, you get what you pay for.

Thanks for that elizard, I've worked for many a nasty painter. No wonder their name is mud.// Ugh.


Yes, some jobs are labour intensive, but I first listen and think, really get to the bottom of what the client actually wants, on budget and do it.

Yeah, one would find out if you needed to replace stucco once you start painting it. If it's that bad, completely falling off, I'd take a pass on the stucco, kind of dated in my opinion. Guess I prefer drywall ceilings, then paint the ceiling like a 5th wall, same colour as the walls.
It's an optical illusion, but the way the light falls, the ceiling looks lighter in colour than the walls and ties the room in nicely.
I've sold that idea to many and they liked the results, as opposed to walking into a room and that stark white ceiling popping out at you, missing the room and furnishing entirely.

Still waiting for photo's from my nephew, did my niece's room like that. One wall was dark chocolate brown, very elegant looking.

Log cabin¿ That sounds amazing./ Pictures, please.
I can't wait to head up north for some backwoods country canoeing & camping. Ahhhhh.

Here's where I found out about that Hemp Oil, which I recommend on any fresh wood. Really brings out the natural glow of the wood. No, I do not work for this company, but the mother and daughter owners producing these paints are on to a great idea and a great product.

I'm going to do a few walls in my appartment with Milk Paint, they have something that can go over previously painted latex walls called Safe Paint. If I need to seal it, I'll oil it with Hemp Oil. It'll eventually dry and won't be greasy. The paint is made of lime, milk protein, clays and earth pigments, I think it should look cool - white or light, light cream colour.

Switching to email to avoid a shop talk derail. Thanks for the links!

And Orange Swan, once again, best of luck with the repair job.