MetaChat - HEY LADIES!

MetaChat is an informal place for MeFites to touch base and post, discuss and chatter about topics that may not belong on MetaFilter. Questions? Check the FAQ. Please note: This is important.

07 November 2007

HEY LADIES! I need your help. If a woman doesn't take her husband's last name, is she a Mrs or a Ms? →[More:] I think that, technically, she'd still be a Ms.

Mrs implies that she is Mr Smith's wife: Mrs Smith. If she marries Mr Smith, but keeps the name Jones, she is still Ms Jones.

Right?

post by: chuckdarwin at: 15:27 | 20 comments

Yes, Ms.

posted by occhiblu 07 November | 15:29

My understanding, and I could be wrong, is that she gets to choose.

posted by box 07 November | 15:30

Do you mean legally, or by convention? I actually don't think there is any legality involved with this, but do agree with box. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that even if she chooses to change her name after marriage, she can still choose to use the honorific Ms.

posted by Lassie 07 November | 15:33

Ms.

posted by gaspode 07 November | 15:33

And of course she can choose, but if you're trying to guess an honorific, then I'd go for Ms. all the way.

posted by gaspode 07 November | 15:34

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that even if she chooses to change her name after marriage, she can still choose to use the honorific Ms.

Yes also to this.

"Ms." specifically does not imply any married, or unmarried state.

"Mrs.," as far as I can tell from the etiquette rules I looked up when dealing with database entries, "officially" only applies when a woman is both married *and* took her husband's last name.

(I would imagine there are women who don't follow that convention, but I think one can go with that as the default.)

posted by occhiblu 07 November | 15:36

The BBC style guide seems to suggest that 'Ms.' should only be used if it's a known preference. Guides to nonsexist language, however (or at least the two I looked at, anyway), disagree.

posted by box 07 November | 15:39

The BBC style guide seems to suggest that 'Ms.' should only be used if it's a known preference

And apparently, sometimes not even then!

posted by Lassie 07 November | 15:45

Confusing things like this is why I use Ms. exclusively, except when I know to use Mrs. (like for my grandmother).

posted by ThePinkSuperhero 07 November | 15:47

Technically, yes, Ms. is the choice. However, it is far worse to tell a lady how she should refer to herself, so don't try to use this thread to "prove" anything.

posted by JanetLand 07 November | 16:14

I now have the song "Me and Mrs. Jones" running through my head.

posted by JanetLand 07 November | 16:22

Not trying to prove anything; I just wanted to have some certainty on it.

posted by chuckdarwin 07 November | 16:57

Unless you want to prove something she agrees with.

posted by pieisexactlythree 07 November | 18:22

I would use Ms in this case. But in Britain, perhaps unlike in America, Ms is not the default choice. In general, use Mrs unless you know she prefers otherwise.

posted by matthewr 07 November | 18:29

In general, use Mrs unless you know she prefers otherwise

Huh? No - use Ms. unless you know what she prefers. "Ms.", like "Mr.", is an honorific that makes no assumptions about the woman's marital status. Because it is absolutely neutral and parallel to male usage it's the way to go when you don't have any other information.

posted by Miko 07 November | 23:04

I think the norm in Britain is still to use Mrs as the default, and Ms only if its a known preference (and perhaps if marital status isn't known). In my experience, Ms is common in business correspondence but much less common elsewhere. It's certainly less common than in America.

We may be creeping towards Ms being the standard, but if even newspaper style guides, which are probably more up-to-speed in these things than most of the populace, can't agree then it's clear there isn't a consensus.

The Guardian (likely to be the most up-to-speed in these things):

We use whichever the woman in question prefers: with most women in public life (Ms Booth, Mrs May, Miss Widdecombe) that preference is well known; if you don't know, try to find out; if that proves impossible, use Ms

The Economist:

Ms is permissible though ugly. Avoid it if you can. To call a woman Miss is not to imply that she is unmarried, merely that she goes by her maiden name. Married women who are known by their maiden names—eg, Aung San Suu Kyi, Benazir Bhutto, Jane Fonda—are therefore Miss, unless they have made it clear that they want to be called something else.

posted by matthewr 08 November | 03:22

The UK is confused about some modern social phenomenon: shocker.

posted by chuckdarwin 08 November | 04:33

Wait, the Economist thinks that if a women is married, but goes by her maiden name, she should be called Miss?

No effin way.

posted by muddgirl 08 November | 08:29

I prefer to be addressed as "Your Majesty."

posted by JanetLand 08 November | 08:40

I think the Economist is missing the point slightly - Ms makes no assumptions about the marital status of the person involved. Do they not recognise that there is a need for such a thing?

I have been Miss or Ms, and haven't been fussy, but am now making a conscious effort to transition to Ms where I can.

posted by altolinguistic 08 November | 09:09

← Winona Ryder + Any dude with a guitar = TLA || small victories (warning: shamelessly self-indulgent long anecdote inside) →

HOME || REGISTER || LOGIN