I'm sorry! *Big Hug*

That story tugs on my heartstrings, it's very human comedy. Someone could psycobabble that you develop these freindships because they are Safe. Someone could newagebabble that you are on this earth in this incarnation as a guide and mentor. But the world is full of bad timing and missed connections. We just keep on keepin' on, and see what's around the bend.

Maybe you just need to set yourself up as an Outing Service, dude. If you're gonna perform this service, you might as well get paid.

If it's an issue of being attracted to guys who don't know they're gay yet, maybe you should ask yourself what it is about them that attracts you. Chances are these guys think of you as a friend and, as rainbaby said, a mentor -- in other words, not part of the potential dating pool.

Having been a "just a friend" hetero for a long time, I sympathize. It wasn't until I stopped trying to date my friends that I found success.

Do you have any/many friends who are already out? Maybe spend more time with the Family, instead of helping boys out with their training wheels.

Oddly, in James Ellroy's The Big Nowhere there's a character who "dosen't truck with man woman child or beast," but get his rocks off getting people to admit that they're gay (he has an instinct for knowing who). Then he puts them to work in his escort service. It all ties into a Red Scare/serial murder (the book is set in 1950) main plot and a gifted but closeted detective who the evil pimp betrays to a demonic Irish cop.

Not that this has anything to do with you, Wolfie, but it made me think of it. You seem to use your powers for good, but it's a hell of a book.

*hugs wolfdaddy*

:( *gives wolfdaddy a hug*.
FWIW, your problem seems to be pretty common among the (admittedly young) gay men of my acquaintance. They're all hoping it gets easier as they get older...

Anway, the best way to break an interpersonal cycle is to be aware of it, as you seem to be. Just...you have to nip that shit in the bud before it starts. Be frank with these guys - you can't be their lover if they want you to be their mentor, it just doesn't work out that way. I think me3dia's comments are spot-on.

Also, a guy I knew in college "wasn't gay" - he only liked straight men.

Ad copy revision:

Maybe you just need to set yourself up as an Outing Service, dude. If you're gonna perform this service, you might as well get paid laid.

Thanks. -Ed

Ah, come to Asheville and we'll go out and get drunk and weep. I'm in a similar albeit heterosexual female sucky pattern situation and last night it upset me so much I cleaned my entire house down to the ground including mopping all the floors and wiping the baseboards. This pattern thing seems to be miserably hard to break; the hell of it is we set them when we're too young to know better and I wish I had answers for you, but all I can offer is a shoulder and a bottle and the belief that eventually all this good karma we have sown will return to us tenfold. Or something. Meanwhile, where does he live, you want me to go toilet paper his house?

Oh, thanks for all the luvvins bunnies and also the kind words and the good words. I *really* appreciate it. It is, to use rainbaby's words, a human comedy that I usually fully appreciate--my sense of irony is finely honed!--but today just got me down in ways that I rarely ever experience. Perhaps this guy was the one I felt was THE one, I don't know.


I think I just have to improve my timing. A LOT. :-D

*I huggles and wubbles you all*

Maybe it is a variation on the old "it could be that your purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others". Maybe your purpose in life is to act as a guide for those emerging from the closet. Things could be worse. Still, I guess being useful doesn't keep you warm at night.

Thanks dg. Your last sentence will be my epitaph, I belive :-)

heh...it's not as uncommon as you think! I tend to attract men i can't/won't have (committed to other people!). My shrink thinks that subconsciously i'm afraid of committment so i give out vibes that attract unavailable men!

(((wolfdaddy)))

I hope you find the right guy at the right time.

well, i think one day you'll be the one to pull em out yourself, and then it'll be worthwhile--and you're totally doing a wonderful mitzvah anyway. Have you ever tried to reconnect with any of them years later? Do you need/want to be the more experienced one?

(oh, and stop going after kids--try older or something)

Wolfdaddy, I raise my glass to you. I've been in the same boat apparently, which has been at sea for the past six years and in dreadfully still waters. I'm not interested in trying to 'convert' (I leave that to my lesbian friends), but I've been hopelessly and haplessly drawn to impossible guys both in and out of the closet. I'm supportive while they are in a whirlwind of existential crisis, and that's that. My heart has developed a very think lining from continuous let-downs, and I just don't even try anymore. If you were local, I'd say let's comiserate at the dive bar. So this crappy cheap beer will have to do. *clink*

amber! I don't go after "kids"! Unless guys in their late-20s to late-30s are "kids". As for older, well, I think I've told you that in the circles I've moved in and the places I've lived all the older guys are either already hooked up ... or dead. :-/

Now I've been in Texas for 18 months. And I'm still culture-shocked...not coping very well with it, either.

I'm just gonna go over here and get drunk with moonbird and mgl. Anyone else who wants to do so, bring some really good red wine.

Ah, wolfdaddy! Jeeze. I have a friend very much in the same position... In new Orleans! Why don't you two get together? ...Yeah, but right. That's not gonna work, is it?

If you are like him, there are plenty falling at your feet, but those aren't the ones you fall for.

I often think that there really is something to the parent connection though, in terms of forming these patterns. I have noticed that many of my friends who get stuck in the longing-for-the-not-quite-available rut usually do have at least one parent (seems like it's usually the dad) with whom they have a bit of a struggle in terms of, I don't know... "assurance of love" or something. Some ambiguity in the relationship. So, yeah - that's probably 75% of the population, or more, and maybe I'm just stating the bloody obvious, or maybe you think I have a Freud doll in my bedroom.

But one thing that has sort of struck me from the moment I moved to Greece, is the relative ease of romantic relationships here - how it seems lighter, more fun, and more friendly. And one thing that is definitely true of Greece is the strength of family and the fact that parents (and the rest of the family) absolutely shower their kids with love and attention. By US or UK standards, children here are very spoiled by their parents - and it never stops. You might be 45, and they'll still be giving you money and doing your laundry. This is general, of course, but I do believe there's a connection. I think sometimes the childhood struggle to resolve/clarify the love relationship with one or more of your parents can carry over, and what seems natural and attractive is something that has some similar ambiguous elements.

I don't know if there's really something to be done about that, if it is the case, but I imagine that for at least a few people getting some kind of "blueprint" of their pattern might make it easier to climb out of the rut a bit. I think, if it were me, I would resolve to date or spend time with a whole lot of people - even those who don't initially attract me necessarily - in a very light, fun way. No looking for Mr. Goodbar, just hanging out with whomever is fun to talk to and makes me laugh... Except the usual the type that always ends up breaking my heart. I'd try this for a good solid block of time... Just to see what happens. It could be that you've been somewhat blind to other more concrete possibilities simply because your head is always too filled with one of the elusive butterflies. Or maybe I should just shut up? dur.

Taz, I so wish I were living in Greece. For the casual nudity (everyone walks around the house naked, it seems) more than the, er, obvious reasons, I think :-)

Why did you move, if I may ask?

the mans, i say

at some point i will say of they boy i dropped
note the boy

oops, forgot to grab my y
again

I moved because I fell in love with a Greek guy in the U.S. And then, after seven years there, we decided to come here. To be honest, it was pretty much a whim, for both of us.

But/// there isn't all that much casual nudity here that I've noticed... though there are still nude beaches. Not as many as there used to be, sadly.

Eesh. I forgot you were in Texas. Any chance of moving?

Hah! Not at this point. Texas is far more affordable than Paradise (ie, Santa Barbara). Sigh.

More wine!