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30 August 2005

WDSU feed from Louisiana (They just switched to another feed from Oklahoma--a bad sign--consider this a Katrina update thread)
Oh dear, not good.
posted by dodgygeezer 30 August | 12:49
and Martial Law now in NO-- Martial Law has been declared in parts of New Orleans as conditions continued to deteriorate. Water levels in The Big Easy and it's suburbs are rising at dangerous levels and officials stated they don't know where the water is coming from. Residents are being urged to get out of New Orleans in any way they can as officials fear "life will be unsustainable" for days or even weeks. ...
posted by amberglow 30 August | 12:56
they might have to airlift tons of people out of town...the feed said there's a few feet of water even around the SuperDome now.
posted by amberglow 30 August | 12:57
Oh hell, I really cannot express how fucking sad this makes me. That city was my home for over a year, I've visited there almost every year for 10 years. My mother has lived there for more than ten years and now her tiny little house that she just moved to is most likely ruined at the very least. I'm glad she left and is ok (although I cannot get through to her at the moment because phones are so fucked up in Jackson MS) but I worry very much about her mental state as she has to figure out what to do, luckily she is swedish and is prepared at all times for calamity and horror.

I am not a public handwringer, but I guess I am just sending out a secular prayer for all the people who are now so totally fucked. I know plenty of totally wonderful, totally broke people in New Orleans and I can only barely imagine what they are facing right now. The poor fucking kids in the projects. Shit shit shit. I love that city and the people in it.
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 13:04
i know, Divine--this is beyond horrendous. i hope she's ok--she will have to stay wherever she is for a while--they won't let people back in for ages. Just now on MSNBC they showed a helicopter zoom of families still up high in their houses waving to be rescued. And some of those litte tiny houses are totally covered in water now too.

I'm very angry that 100% of our resources are not available for this. Furious.
posted by amberglow 30 August | 13:16
mr. gaspode and I frequently go to NO. It was our first trip away together, and we went there for our honeymoon. I hope that everyone who has friends and family there can get in contact with them soon. As for me...my first stop is here.
posted by gaspode 30 August | 13:18
I lived there for three years and while I know my people are safe, if I ever go back, and I always want to go back, what will it be like? I've been worthless. As of last night, it seemed like it would be the same place, now - no.
posted by rainbaby 30 August | 13:30
Well rainbaby it's been in the mail for a long time, I think in a hippy-dippy emotio-spiritual way one of the things that made/makes New Orleans special is that it was always at or over the edge of a disaster; social, environmental, financial, substance abusewise. The city will always exist in some sense, although more and more in a memorial way as the water keeps encroaching on it. The proof is in the pudding on that I think, this was not a direct hit and the flooding is only getting worse now. When I lived there I sometimes went and looked at the pumping stations and I was always struck by same image, a little kid digging a hole in the sand at the edge of the waterline and hitting that part of the hole where the water just keeps seeping in from the bottom. At some point the kid gets tired of it and stops bailing.


With all that in mind, I am going back there as soon as I can and my new toast from now until whenever (derived from the old zionist toast):

Next year in N'awlins.
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 13:44
Thanks for the link, amberglow. I'm going to tune in right now.
posted by iconomy 30 August | 14:09
It's not working for me but I'll keep trying. The videos work, just not the live feed.

The interview with the man who lost his wife and his house...gah.
posted by iconomy 30 August | 14:19
Now the live feed's here.
posted by iconomy 30 August | 14:21
i changed my top link--thanks ico...

i can't believe someone killed themself at the Superdome already...and they say more levees will give way...

God...
posted by amberglow 30 August | 15:32
I am in the process of looking for housing in the Houston area for several families from the NO area. We have even started talking about enrolling the children in the local schools, because the news looks so bad back home.
posted by sarah connor 30 August | 15:43
I downloaded realshitplayer but I still can not get this to work. I give up.
posted by weretable and the undead chairs 30 August | 15:55
I can't believe this. I'm wondering where my friends are... and I have no idea how I'm going eventually contact them... Has anyone heard anything about Mandeville, or the North Shore in general? I have a friend who might have gone there to take care of her parents - though I hope they left, they very well might not have.

I'm just stunned. I can't believe I went to bed last night feeling relieved the N.O. dodged the bullet.
posted by taz 30 August | 16:15
Taz
This is the nola.com forum where people are checking in and trying to report on specific areas in orleans parish, you can back out for other parishes. Bear in mind that it is raw, miserable, may be totally wrong and so on.
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 16:21
Wow.
posted by rainbaby 30 August | 16:36
Thanks for those Divine_Wino - from what I can tell, Mandeville is relatively okay... at least compared to surrounding areas.

I just heard that the French Quarter (where many friends live) is still dry... And I have my fingers crossed for the Marigny where a friend has a house...

Oh god.
posted by taz 30 August | 16:38
Wait, someone killed themselves?

This is terrible.
posted by Specklet 30 August | 16:40
And now a policeman has been shot by a looter. Horrible. Law enforcement needs to forget about looters (some of whom are trying to get basic neccessities) and just concentrate on rescue.
posted by taz 30 August | 17:26
Taz
Sadly those looters are taking basic neccessities from people who are not able enough to loot (they would be broken out and distributed in an ideal situation), it's a fuck up all around. As amberglow and others have said, the fucking sin, the deep deep terrible sin here is that the fucking national guard is over in Iraq instead of being at home to help in situations like this. Such a waste.
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 17:33
True.
posted by taz 30 August | 17:46
As amberglow and others have said, the fucking sin, the deep deep terrible sin here is that the fucking national guard is over in Iraq instead of being at home to help in situations like this. Such a waste.

Exactly--i'm livid about this--they took amphibious vehicles to the desert instead of leaving there in the Gulf. More people could have been saved. Absolutely furious. Some of those Guards in the Gulf are cops and firemen too and could be helping save people. Even the regular Army is needed for this, like they used for Andrew. I've never been more disgusted with Bush in my entire life--how fucking dare he take necessary people out of this country for bullshit???
posted by amberglow 30 August | 17:59
I love how CNN is making a big deal over Bush cutting short his vacation to return to DC.

I'm with amberglow, the whole situation just makes me shake with rage. It is his fault they don't have the manpower necessary to save lives, and we're supposed to look at him like a hero because he puts off his golf game for a couple weeks? disgusting.
posted by kellydamnit 30 August | 18:03
And I'm gonna give a big my aunt fanny to the cnn reports that Nat Guard levels are at 70% of capacity in the area, where the fuck are they?
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 18:03
Just saw Canal Street and the Iberville projects... Not too bad, really there, I'm glad to see. I've waded through water that high in the French Quarter before.

The Times Picayune blog says (some) policemen are joining in the looting (permalink to the story doesn't work). "“The police got all the best stuff. They’re crookeder than us,” one man said."

Good old nola cops.
posted by taz 30 August | 18:08
Fer real taz. The NOPD make racist caricatures of Tiajuana cops from the 50s look like dick tracy. Coooooorrrrrrruuuuuuupppppppppttttttt!
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 18:18
And I'm gonna give a big my aunt fanny to the cnn reports that Nat Guard levels are at 70% of capacity in the area, where the fuck are they?

I know...i've been working at home all day, and watching the feed and CNN and i see Coast Guard and cops and firemen--where are the supposed 100k+ Guards available to help? (acc. to a Major General in DC--see the mefi thread).
posted by amberglow 30 August | 18:22
And why are they not stopping looters and so on, and evacuating people? From the NOLA blog:


Law enforcement efforts to contain the emergency left by Katrina slipped into chaos in parts of New Orleans Tuesday with some police officers and firefighters joining looters in picking stores clean.

At the Wal-Mart on Tchoupitoulas Street, an initial effort to hand out provisions to stranded citizens quickly disintegrated into mass looting. Authorities at the scene said bedlam erupted after the giveaway was announced over the radio.

While many people carried out food and essential supplies, others cleared out jewelry racks and carted out computers, TVs and appliances on handtrucks.

Some officers joined in taking whatever they could, including one New Orleans cop who loaded a shopping cart with a compact computer and a 27-inch flat screen television...

...One veteran officer said, “It’s like this everywhere in the city. This tiny number of cops can’t do anything about this. It’s wide open.”



Nothing to see here citizen move along.
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 18:27
From the LA Times:

Around the corner on Canal Street, the main thoroughfare in the central business district, people sloshed headlong through hip-deep water as looters ripped open the steel gates on the front of several clothing and jewelry stores.

One man, who had about 10 pairs of jeans draped over his left arm, was asked if he was salvaging things from his store.

"No," the man shouted, "that's EVERYBODY'S store."

Looters filled industrial-sized garbage cans with clothing and jewelry and floated them down the street on bits of plywood and insulation as National Guard lumbered by.

Mike Franklin stood on the trolley tracks and watched the spectacle unfold.

"To be honest with you, people who are oppressed all their lives, man, it's an opportunity to get back at society," he said.

This makes me incredibly sad on many different levels.
posted by mudpuppie 30 August | 18:33
i'd be looting food and water if i was there.
posted by amberglow 30 August | 18:37
More, from the same article:

At a drug store on Canal Street just outside the French Quarter, two police officers with pump shotguns stood guard as workers from the Ritz-Carlton Hotel across the street loaded large laundry bins full of medications, snack foods and bottled water.

"This is for the sick," Officer Jeff Jacob said. "We can commandeer whatever we see fit, whatever is necessary to maintain law."

Another office, D.J. Butler, told the crowd standing around that they would be out of the way as soon as they got the necessities.

"I'm not saying you're welcome to it," the officer said. "This is the situation we're in. We have to make the best of it."

The looting was taking place in full view of passing National Guard trucks and police cruisers.
posted by mudpuppie 30 August | 18:38
look and weep
posted by amberglow 30 August | 18:39
Well, what I read said he's not headed back to Washington until tomorrow. The WH has issued a statement saying he's cutting his vacation 2 days short (as if this is a sacrifice, when this particular vacation officially landed him the record of most vacation days a president has ever taken).

I'm not saying the hurricane damage is Bush's fault, but he sure isn't giving the right impression. Especially when you factor in what amberglow has already mentioned about the National Guard (whose duty it is to help us at times like these) being on the other side of the world fighting a stupid, unwinnable war.

Or were you being sarcastic, Specklet?
posted by mudpuppie 30 August | 18:59
Sorry Specklet. It was stupid of me not to click on the link before responding. Never mind!
posted by mudpuppie 30 August | 19:01
and i thought that he could work at the ranch just like at the White House, and that he really wasn't on vacation at all--ever--which is all total bullshit. Like father, like son--remember Andrew? (and this is much bigger and more spread out)
posted by amberglow 30 August | 19:02
I feel sorry for the National Guard members in Iraq and elsewhere that are FROM the affected areas. You know they feel like they should be at home helping.
posted by weretable and the undead chairs 30 August | 19:23
Me too, my sisters ex is a captain in the Louisiana National Guard and he just got blown up in Iraq and is fixing to have his legs removed in DC and my sister told me he is fucking crying right now about what he could be doing if he was there instead of in a hospital bed. Which is a totally manipulative strawman thing for me to say, but I'ma saying it.

On another note, I posted this over on metafilter, cause I been thinking about it and as much as hate Bush I would rather hold further complaints until there is a better picture of what is acutally going on.
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 19:31
so goodnight my darlings, I am going home.
posted by Divine_Wino 30 August | 19:32
Good night, Divine_Wino; I hope we somehow have better news tomorrow.
posted by taz 30 August | 19:49
Oh, god... Sorry for the caps, but I just copied this from the WWL site:

****ALL RESIDENTS ON THE EAST BANK OF ORLEANS AND JEFFERSON REMAINING IN THE METRO AREA ARE BEING TOLD TO EVACUATE AS EFFORTS TO SANDBAG THE LEVEE BREAK HAVE ENDED. THE PUMPS IN THAT AREA ARE EXPECTED TO FAIL SOON AND 12-15 FEET OF WATER ARE EXPECTED IN THE ENTIRE EAST BANK.****

That's it.
posted by taz 30 August | 19:55
Any news on ColdChef?
posted by moonbird 30 August | 21:07
update from ColdChef
posted by anastasiav 30 August | 21:17
I said in chat last night that it was a good thing that it wasn't as bad as expected. Famous last words. It just keeps getting worse.

And I'm with amberglow, I'd be getting myself food and water as necessary (said as much to my husband not 15 minutes ago). Those looting for other things should be shot, cops included.

I'm glad ColdChef is doing okay.
posted by deborah 30 August | 21:45
Some 'lighter' flickr pics tagged as Katrina.

[ok, a couple are not as 'light' as the others -- and this is certainly not to deflect away from this devastating situation -- but I was thumbing through and they caught my eye and sometimes looking at things from a different view can be um......well, you know..]
posted by peacay 30 August | 22:16
they never repaired the levee breaches at all--the big army sandbagging never happened. more water's still pouring in, and there are still people in their attics/on roofs.

(that voodoo doll and frog!--thanks peacay--i have a packet of love herbs hanging over my front door--"to ensure a peaceful home") : >
posted by amberglow 30 August | 22:22
Yeah...listening to the Mayor of NO at the moment --- he's really pissed off about the chopper not showing up with the sandbags.
So the water will come through the levee, and take all in the 'bowl' up to gulf water level in next 12-15 hours. That means that most of NO will be under 9ft of water and even moreso for lower lying areas. Shit!
posted by peacay 30 August | 22:47
and there are still people to be rescued...most of those houses are not tall enough to withstand more water, i don't think.
posted by amberglow 30 August | 23:35
All of the bad flooding is on the East Bank, right? The West Bank is mostly okay? Or is part of the West Bank really flooded too?
posted by weretable and the undead chairs 30 August | 23:50
It's just unbelievable. I had no idea this was going on today - computer off because of high winds & power surges here, no TV - and I just didn't know. Where the hell do they think those people are going to go? If/when they evacuate the Superdome, where will those 10,000 or 30,000 or 60,000 (I saw all 3 numbers in my last 2 hours of horrified surfing)refugees go?
posted by mygothlaundry 30 August | 23:52
i think the West Bank's ok, but they don't have power or water or plumbing either, and won't as long as the other parts are out. And they had damage from the hurricane itself, of course.

they're starting to bus people to Kenner, CNN said, but i don't think that's the last stop.
posted by amberglow 30 August | 23:58
listening to the Mayor of NO at the moment --- he's really pissed off about the chopper not showing up with the sandbags.

My sympathy to New Or, but the Mayor "This is our tsunami" is an asshat. Last I checked, the 2004 tsunami killed over 300,000 people. Not to play a numbers game, but the lack of perspective just blows me away. They also had no warning. Oh, and says the governor: "This looks like Hiroshima after the bomb." WTF.
posted by dreamsign 31 August | 09:21
Mayor "This is our tsunami" was A. J. Holloway, mayor of Biloxi. Governor "this is what Hiroshima looked like" was Haley Barbour, governor of Mississippi.

This disaster is much bigger than just New Orleans.
posted by ewagoner 31 August | 09:45
Mississippi has thousands dead they're saying in the mefi thread.

I don't see how the AstroDome is a good shelter for the SuperDome people.
posted by amberglow 31 August | 11:40
I'm a bit tired of the "New Orleans is gone, accept it and move on" stuff that I'm seeing on metafilter and elsewhere. If it's gone, permanently, it should be accepted. But people from far, far from the city and region must realize the incredible significance of New Orleans not only historically and culturally but as a port. The city may indeed be gone. But no one without strong ties to the area should be so frickin' smug at this point.
posted by raysmj 31 August | 12:48
And it's not gone anyway--it's just totally flooded. They'll rebuild. I wish we had some leadership with vision that didn't involve death and destruction and oil alone--there are lots of great ideas that could be tried re: urban planning/design and stuff, as well as being a showcase for engineering projects that could help the Dutch and Venice and other low-lying places like Indonesia, etc. Lemonade could be made out of this horror, but it probably won't be, tragically.
posted by amberglow 31 August | 12:55
The thing I find hardest to understand is how the richest and most powerful country in the world completely failed to evacuate the area effectively. Now I know some people weren't going to leave no matter what, but I can't seriously believe that many people wanted to stay.

Now this may seem crass to some but in a way this whole thing makes me think of Titanic: the well off get to make their escape while the poor people are stuck in the lower decks without a lifeboat in sight.

Do I blame Bush? Yes and no. I mean, where's the outrage? Giving money to the Red Cross is all well and good, but doesn't a government have a responsibility to it's people anymore? And if it doesn't then what's the damn point of it in the first place?

All that money sloshing around over there and they can't afford to move some people out of a disaster waiting to happen.

Sorry, rant over
posted by dodgygeezer 31 August | 13:21
I want to agree with that, dodgy, but the numbers and the logistics are incredible. To begin with, you have to think about the number of tropical storms/hurricanes each year (and they go by the alphabet, so with "K" for Katrina, it means that there've been 10 storms before this one, just this year), and all the states affected or possibly affected each time.

Now, let's just assume that you only do this with category 4 or 5 storms, you would still have had to mobilize transportation and secure shelter for thousands and thousands from at least four states... just for this storm, this time. And there may be another cat. 4 or 5 storm this year. And maybe even another. It's totally unpredictable.

Then, to get even more down to brass tacks: for New Orleans alone, mass transportation out is a total nightmare; you basically have one escape route out, and that traffic is bumper to bumper inching along what is basically this little bridge over the swamps... it's not called "the isle of orleans" for nothing. Once you try to get out of town under these circumstances, you realize how really cut off New Orleans is. I can't even imagine how it could be done.

But the truth is that everyone has known this forever. No one who's ever lived in New Orleans and been the slightest bit alert (as in respirating and able to swallow his/her own spittle) hasn't always known about the "bowl effect". The two or three versions of the "perfect storm" and the "bowl effect" have been the New Orleans bogeymen for at least 40 or 50 years (could get better figures - but, too lazy).

The only thing that could have protected against the total fucking hell of misery that is New Orleans today, is the money it would have taken to secure the levee and pumping infrastructure - a massive amount (could get better figures - but, too lazy), but something that anybody with a brain has always known was absolutely necessary. Not the kind of thing that garners votes and political popularity however, when everybody has air conditioning and Abita Beer and sharks and dead bodies aren't swimming in the streets while people try to cling to life on top of their roofs.

I would proof read this screed, but I'm too lazy. And the pizza is here.
posted by taz 31 August | 16:10
So very sorry, guys. Hugs and kisses and all that other meaningless stuff that's over-offered in times like these. Don't have much else. =(

kicks dirt and hunches off
posted by Frisbee Girl 31 August | 16:19
taz: Of course no one in New Orleans had EVER thought of that.
posted by raysmj 31 August | 18:39
Corrected.

If it's gone, permanently, it should be accepted.

I don't know if all that wood will fare well. And consider that flooding at this level typically brings disease. There are a lot of bodies in that water.

The thing I find hardest to understand is how the richest and most powerful country in the world completely failed to evacuate the area effectively.

My coworker has relatives there. They refused to leave. Last I read, only 80% had left.
posted by dreamsign 31 August | 22:30
I saw them talking to a rescuer earlier and he was saying that some of the people he rescued did not know what was going on until water was actually coming into their house. Someone (part of the NO city gov?) was saying that there will probably be a lot of people found dead in attics where they drowned after taking shelter there not thinking the water would soon be almost at the top of their house. Thousands expected dead and with estimates of 80,000+ people remaining in the city and only around 23,000 of those at the Superdome, the death toll could be extremely high. Aren't there places south of NO? Some island or something? I have heard nothing at all about that area.
posted by weretable and the undead chairs 31 August | 23:03
Grand Isle? (non-katrina info)
posted by taz 31 August | 23:38
a historic and massive failure of leadership on every level--these people are starving and dying there.
posted by amberglow 01 September | 13:29
Good lord. My apartment building lost power after a pole came down late Tuesday afternoon. I've been away from the news, away from the computer. I went to bed on Tuesday night relieved that it wasn't as bad as it could have been. The power came on a little while ago and I jumped online to catch up and I'm just dumbfounded. I'm relieved to hear that ColdChef is OK but sending lots of prayers for his wife's family. And everyone along the coast. I just can't fathom what's happening down there.
posted by LeeJay 01 September | 16:09
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