Saving up money to have the *possibility* of being independent is a separate goal from ending the relationship. Who knows -- you may find that once you *really* have the option to leave, it'll give you enough confidence that you won't have to leave.

So, what would it be like for you to marshal the resources that you need to give yourself the option, and then reassess?

well, i've tried to breakup with him before twice and ended up staying. most recently about two months ago.

but he just can't meet my needs and i don't think i meet his.

i've been very poor before so im not concerned about not having cable or a wii or whatever.

i've just never done this before. the last long term live together thing ended very badly. i've been emailing about apts on craigslist. places where i am can be had for $500 or so a month and in decent areas. i'd be willing to put some stuff on my credit card if need be.

i guess it's hard to just decide to do it. 6 years is a long time and i know im gonna hurt him. i guess i feel fake for hanging around like everything is ok when i know it's not. i mean, he knows it's not too. bleh.

i'm gonna really miss him. but we're just not right.

It sounds like you're really struggling to do what's right for everyone which can be nearly impossible. Sending big hugs and wuffles to you...

thanks. i think i do want to do it without hurting anyone. not gonna happen.

at least i'll have all these on askme to remember why i left when i miss the good parts.

I couldn't find your AskMe question so I don't understand why you're breaking up.

it was anonymous. this is also not my real name.

this is the most recent
http://ask.metafilter.com/200968/talk-therapy-requires-talk

the others were under a sockpuppet on askme.
i'm just super embarrassed about the whole thing. i guess i shouldnt' be. i'm kind of ashamed too that i let it go this long.

oh well, that link tag wasn't closed.

fixed that for you.

i'm kind of ashamed too that i let it go this long.

Whereas I think you can be... "proud of yourself" is perhaps not quite the right sentiment for this situation, but you've done the hard work of figuring out what you want and need in a partnership, realizing that you're not going to get it in your current relationship, and doing your best to end it compassionately. That's certainly nothing to be embarrassed by or ashamed of.

It sounds like you're getting a handle on the practicalities of moving out, which is good. It doesn't sound like you've got a handle on the fact that your boyfriend is really failing to meet you halfway and work on his problems, too. That's a huge, huge issue. And reading your question, it seemed to me as an outside observer that you were working hard to be a fair as you could be in describing the situation. But ultimately, you don't need to be "fair", you need to be in a functional relationship, and your boyfriend is refusing to help your relationship function.

As for when to break up -- there will never be a "good" time. The best case would be when you feel financially capable of moving out, but if you have friends and family in the area, would staying with them for awhile be an option?

Hugs. This is hard stuff to deal with.

If you're ending a 6 year relationship I think it is very okay to lean on the RL friends and family a little, in terms of just having people to talk to.

It sounds like you need to just do it, get to the next chapter of your life. You'll be doing new stuff and you'll look back at this and wonder why you hesitated. I'm always amazed by that myself because I often get stuck in cycles of thought where it seems like everything is overwhelming.

I don't understand virtual hugs but I'd give you a real one if it was possible.

So far everything that has been suggested sounds like real good advice. Let me add my 2 long-winded cents here...

I was in a 6ish year relationship too once. We where rendered stupid in our love for each other. The kind of stupid you just want to fall into and never come out of. We where completely bonded. And then I broke up with him.

I knew deep down and finally admitted to myself that he couldn't really deal with being honest with himself about things I thought where important in a relationship. I knew he just could not face the questions let alone bring up the "something is not right" conversation. He didn't quite have the experience or the maturity.

I could have let it go but I knew down the line it would ruin us, ruin him, so I had to end it. I stepped up to the plate because I loved him so. I did it because it was what he and I both needed.

And that first step was the hardest part; just saying the words.

After that hurdle, I dealt with the things that came up, one at a time. It wasn't all candy and cakes but I had friends to rely on for support and I was in therapy at the time. I was also in a position to get my own place and I kept my daily schedule like a very strong emotional anchor of normalcy.

The bottom line...each of us deserved better than we could ultimately give each other. The life-lesson? Love isn't enough to make a relationship work. It sucks but it's true.

So, whatever you decide is best for you and for him, know that you are doing it out of love. Know that you have agonized over this because you are a thoughtful caring loving person that wants the best for both of you. It may not be easy all the time but if you stay this course, you will, and he will, be better for it, in time.

{{{mollycase}}}

you don't want to hurt anyone, but sometimes it's overall less painful to rip the band-aid off.

you should never feel trapped. You can (almost) always return to a good relationship. If you love someone, set them free, and all.

thanks guys. i really needed that and i'll probably come back to read this over the coming weeks.

If you tried to break up with him and it didn't stick, was it because you caved or he pressured? Will you be able to safely leave this relationship?

He doesn't sound interested in fixing anything. You really need to think about what's best for you. It could be staying and saving money, it could be getting out as soon as possible, but it sounds like you've been far too concerned about his feelings over your own. Knowing what you want and doing it will be better for you both, but I think you should be more concerned with yourself. Six years is a long time and change is not easy, but often necessary. Good luck and be safe. If there is any kind of problem, don't hesitate to just go when he is not around. Really, after two break up attempts and everything else, it's surprising he doesn't see it coming. Surprising is the charitable interpretation.

How can he not know you want to break up with him? Does he think all the stuff going on is just going to fix itself if he ignores it? Maybe if you tell him, he'd wake up and address the situation.

After having read your AskMe, I think you should definitely break-up with him very, very soon. Moving to a new apartment is going to fuck your savings (if you have any), but it's a much better option than continuing to be in a relationship with someone who doesn't seem to care about you as a person.

I'm a big fan of therapy myself (having been in it for 4 years or so), but I can understand his anger at being in therapy because if he doesn't think there's anything wrong with him, then knowing that someone else is seeing that side of him that does exist can hurt. Believe me, I still have problems telling my therapist about my childhood, even if I know that one of the root causes of some of my issues is how I was raised. (Note how I have cleverly stepped around any personal judgments about my parents? The brain is sneaky like that.) But I don't think that I could have gotten as far as I have without opening up and being totally honest about my feelings. If he can't do that, he can never get any help, and that's going to be bad for you.

As for doing a move before the holidays, at least you have more time to find a place than I did back in 2008/2009. However, I got a story segment produced on "This American Life" as a result, and that's not so bad, right? :)

i've told him before, many times. he'll try for like a little bit but then it's back to same old, same old.
i think i just need to do it after i've found a place.
at least i don't work during the day and have some friends who can help me move during the day as well.

i LOVE This American Life. i'll have to check that out!

I don't understand virtual hugs but I'd give you a real one if it was possible.

fleacircus, I think you understand virtual hugs very well. :-)

Sorry to be late to this, and let me start with a big virtual hug. {{{{mollycase}}}}

Here's what I'm picking up from you: 1) you aren't happy in this relationship; 2) your BF hasn't consistently addressed the problems in this relationship; and 3) you have really tried.

Realistically, many serious relationships fail because they just don't quite work. It's like fitting jigsaw pieces that look like they should go, but don't, into place -- no matter how much effort, it doesn't produce the desired result, short of deforming the piece.

The right relationship for you will feel very, very easy, right from the get go. It could be a friendship that becomes a romantic relationship, or lightning could strike, but it will be easy. This is good, because it takes a lot of compatibility to later be able to talk about and resolve serious questions like where to live and whether to have kids and money management, etc.

This is an important relationship, but it also sounds like an irretrievably flawed one. It is really kindest for both you AND your BF to move on. And it isn't anyone's fault.

I think it is likely he'll be angry and upset but be nice, don't blame him, be accomodating about working out financial arrangements if you need to, and go ahead and do what you need here

Finishing with another big internet hug. This is never fun. {{{mollycase}}}

P.S. Strange but true -- a short fling that isn't serious at all is often a very good way to help yourself move along. That should happen AFTER you move, of course.

Well, you're probably not going to like what I'm going to say, and others may disagree (I always say that when it comes to advice, take what you find useful and ignore the rest, and that certainly applies here), but, based on what I've read here and in your AskMe link, breaking up with him will not make you happy. You may want to anyway, I don't know, but as someone who's been through similar situations (and what do we have to go on but ourselves?), what you're looking for, happiness and a sense of wholeness in yourself, you can't get from him or anyone else. By your descriptions, it seems to me like you're looking for him to meet emotional needs that only you can meet for yourself. He can be your companion, your lover, your friend, but he can't make you whole. With or without him, you'll have to do that for yourself. And, I don't know, he sounds like a decent guy, at least I haven't heard any real deal breakers here, and love is hard to come by. Are you sure it's not you who can't accept the quiet contentment of your lives together, flaws and all? Are you sure it's not you who's afraid to move forward (marriage, kids, if you want those things)? Are you sure (from one, hopefully former, drama queen to another) it's not you who's addicted to the excitement of drama (I'm thinking of the two previous break-up attempts)? If he loves you (and that's a lot), and if you love him and feel you would miss him so, as you say, maybe just let him be. Maybe it's just how he is, not wanting to talk about stuff a lot, and maybe that's okay. Maybe just keep working on yourself, as you are, and let him come to deal with himself in his own way. You can still share a life together, even so.

Well, I don't really know you, of course, but I'd really think twice before throwing your relationship away. Good luck, though, in any case. Hope this was in some way helpful.

I agreed with what pips wrote and then read the AskMe and wasn't so sure. I think, though, that your situation is one that AskMe is not very helpful for, to be honest. The default DTMFA position that always seems to be the case there doesn't really work well for a situation that's kind of lineball like yours, in that there's not a specific, tangible problem that is clearly one side's fault.

I know it goes against what the popular perception (and what most have said here) is, but maybe you're expecting too much from him? Some people (like me) are not comfortable with the idea of couples therapy because there is so much at stake, not because we are somehow broken and need to be fixed (although this could also be the case, of course). If things go badly in this type of situation, the couple can't just move on the way a therapist can and, for someone that is not great at sharing their feelings, there is a risk (or a perceived risk) of doing so in a way that makes things worse. I'm not very good at using my words - I know I'm not explaining this properly.

The way that relationships are portrayed in the media (and have been since movies got sound) has a lot to answer for, in my opinion. Relationships are almost never this perfect, blinding flash of love kind of thing with sunshine and puppies for all. There are bad parts of relationships and there are good parts - do the maths and see how it works out. If it's negative (or not positive enough to reach whatever threshold you set for an acceptable match), it's no good, otherwise, maybe your goals are too high?

I hesitated to post this, because it's completely opposed to the prevalent views, but it was stuck in my mind so there it is. Take it with a grain of salt as the advice from a grumpy old man who is pretty cynical about the expecations that most people put on life and is totally unsurprised that so many are unhappy as a result.

i caved. that's why it didnt go thru last time.

i appreciate the dissenting views, but honestly couples therapy was a last resort.

i dont expect EVERYTHING from him, but if i didnt touch him, we could go days. when he comes from work, it's a sigh. in the morning, im lucky if i get a pat on the shoulder. it's been like this forever and i kept thinking that one day he'd be more affectionate. i would just like the basic emotional respect of most normal relationships that i see around me. i do have other close friends and interests i pursue on my own. but it's not just one thing, it's the whole conglomeration of things over the years.

for a long time he thought i was depressed, or bipolar, or whatever. i thought so too and sought out treatment and therapy. im much happier and more satisfied with myself than i ever been. he's just as withdrawn except his excuse for not being emotionally open and affectionate is now that i dont exercise enough, when it used to be that being depressed or anxious bothered him.

im sure that he has reasons...some people have suggested asperger's or depression. and that's fine. but if he wont work to be closer to me then what is there for me?

i know it's hard to judge from a few posts on the internet, but this is something i've discussed with two close friends who also know him, and they agree and understand my decision.

i will miss him BECAUSE i like him...otherwise i wouldnt have stayed this long. it's just not a romantic relationship.

I'm really surprised at Pips and dg with this settle business. There are a lot of negotiable things in a relationship, kinks, space, what have you, but fear, apathy and self blame?
Dg, I haven't been on much recently, but I have never heard you say anything positive about your marriage, which I have never directly brought up because it seemed like picking a scab, but you always sound so very unhappy. I'm really surprised you would suggest someone choose that as an option. It sounds like more than cynicism, and I'm considered deeply cynical by some.

thanks everyone! i've been rereading some of the comments and it's helping keep in mind why i am leaving, that it's ok that it hurts, and i have to do what's best for me. i might need to ask the pdoc for some extra ativan but i think i'll be ok.

i spoke with a friend and i can stay with her until i find a place. and i've had offers for turkey day as well.

For me, it's not about settling, eth, it's about realistic expectations, as dg talks about, and accepting each other. But everyone's gotta find out for themselves.

Still, only you know what's best for you, mollycase. Sounded like you'd really already decided to leave, so I'm not surprised. In any case, all the best.

Metachat and ask.me are so rich in wise people.

I believe everyone should have a backup plan, some cash and resources in case life deals out lemons. Whether it gets used for unexpected job loss, illness, a mid-life crisis sports car, or the ability to leave if you need to, it's a good idea.

Your ask.me is all "Boyfriend, boyfriend, boyfriend, boyfriend." Where are you? It doesn't work to be defined by someone else. It doesn't work for you, or for the other person. Therapy can help you deal with your life, define yourself, deal with your past, trauma, and, even, sometimes, deal with real mental illness. Couple therapy can help couples see what's going on, define problems and strengths, learn new ways to resolve problems, etc.

Decide what you want, what direction you're headed in, and see if BF can or will be there with you.