I like his music, he seems like a bit of a freakshow, btu often I feel like his heart is in the right place, I just have no idea what he's up to most of the time.

I'm confused about the "heart in the right place" part. The latest outburst? His OMG I SHOULDA WON past outbursts? I don't get it.

See, I love that. He wants to see it go down HIS WAY, goddamit, and in his world he is the best. Therefore, he (or his friends) should win.

I did say he was crazy. And he kind of is. But that's part of why I like him.

I say his heart's in the right place because he hates homophobia in hip-hop, and I still love his "George Bush doesn't care about black people" outburst after Katrina, because he was right in that case.

A rapper steals the mic from a country singer, my two least favorite forms of music. Although it did make 'jackass' an official presidential decree. Shouldn't we have a commemoration event or something?

Hmm. I think the anti-homophobia and freak-show thing kinda go together. In that he's only that much of a freak because he's in an environment that's been pretty cloistered for a while, at least in its mainstream forms, about what constitutes virtuous/cool behaviour versus what doesn't. In other words, Kanye isn't necessarily a freak show, he's a fish out of water.. okay I could find a better metaphor given the context but you follow.

I like him, too. People so shocked at this Taylor Swift seem to have forgotten that this was the man that called the President a racist on live TV. HE'S CRAZY. At least he's consistent.

He seems like the kind of larger-than-life character that used to populate the entertainment world, before it all got so corporate and safe.

One of the things that bugs me is this, actually, since his awkward persona is largely created from scratch. It's sort of his compensation for growing up middle-class in a quasi-academic environment.

Sure, it's a persona... just like Tom Waits or the B-52's. I like performers who create larger-than-life characters.

I don't know his work but I have always kinda liked his public persona until this latest stunt. Calling out the president and hyping your own work is one thing but shitting all over someone else's party was just a "jackass" move.

If it had been the Sex Pistols shitting all over some twee BBC pop star in 1976, it would have been hilarious, though, wouldn't it?

Kanye's not the Sex Pistols, by any means, but c'mon, country pop stars NEED to be humiliated for the greater good of mankind.

He ain't the Pistols or even Malcolm, for that matter, but I don't know that Taylor Swift (I hate her voice) is even equivocally related to a twee BBC pop star of yore.

Folks seem to find something in her songs that I think places her closer to the folk rock of the 70's. Still, she is new and could be turned into a new pop tart. I hope not though.

I could have forgiven Sid for such a stunt because he was such an outsider and used by all and still wanting to please. John is too bright and talented. I would not have forgiven him.

I don't know man. I think Iggy Pop is an asshole here in 1977. There's being larger than life and then there's being an ass, and getting all social hierarchy based on some acceptable index of bullying as correlated to artistic virtue seems—besides arbitrary—mean. You can call people out in your music. You can call people out in interviews. You wanna be boorish, that's idiotic. I think the Norman Mailer/Barney Frank vibe is passé.

There's also a bit of a 'pick on somebody your own size' issue. Pop stars are more powerful than certain acts you'd like in a money/popularity way, sure, but they're also not out there hating on you. If 50 and Kanye go at it like in 07, that's one thing. Maybe even Pink. But Taylor Swift? WTF?

And he didn't even do it that way, "taylor swift sucks" wasn't his official stance. It was like.. "I have a message that supersedes whatever she's upto on this stage." His process is the problem; not his opinion.

Damn, thanks for that link Firas. I'd forgotten that interview and it's great to be reminded of just how great an interviewer Peter Gzowski was.

This thread makes me so so happy. Thank you, BP. I really like Kanye West too. When 808s and Heartbreak came out I remember reading that his mom had just died from complications from cosmetic surgery. I mean, how fucked up is that? I see the Bush moment often called out as "inappropriate" - how? It seems spectacularly, singularly appropriate.

And gosh, when I finally got around to watching the latest "outburst", what a nontroversy. He talked for, what, 30 seconds? That's why it's such great parody/meme fodder. It's almost bizarrely polite. It's surreal and the jokes write themselves.

I'm not saying all, but some of the, especially the really dehumanizing "he's a piece of shit", backlash definitely sounds a bit racist to my ear. And that's what saddens me the most. That seems like a pretty extreme reaction.

I loved his Bush call out. But I don't really care about this...probably because it was the VMAs and the people involved were all inside that world. Only thing worse is the Espys.

*notes down "nontroversy" in Notebook of Cool Neologisms*

I liked his production style years ago, with the sped-up soul samples and whatnot (though it's not like he pioneered that or anything). Of course, I like the Bush thing. I probably wouldn't be inclined to give him a whole lot of credit about speaking out against homophobia in hip-hop, among other reasons because I don't think he puts his money where his mouth is (e.g., Rhymefest). I like very much that his touring DJ is A-Trak, who is one of the best scratch/battle DJs that ever lived (check out the Kanye's Soul Mix Show mixtape). I also like that he seems to appreciate art and design and stuff like that--even if his tastes aren't mine. For the most part, I don't really care for his music.

Aside from that, I don't really know that much about dude.

While I don't think what he did was very sporting and I fully admit I felt bad for Taylor Swift in that moment (don't like her music all that much, but I think she's adorable), I really can't hate on Kanye quite honestly. And honestly, I'm sorry a 19 year old got her heart broken and put in an awkward position, but Beyonce called her back up on stage and she's got all these people, including Barack Obama, who got her back. Like it went from kind of crazy to an awesome moment for her.

Like I don't think he's a malicious jerkface. He just seems to genuinely not realize how bad of an idea something is until he does it. Or maybe it's the exact opposite and he's too aware. He didn't go up there with the intention to punch Taylor Swift in the face, snatch the Moon Man from her and give it to Beyonce. Like it's this thing he's cultivated. Like how it's been pointed out on this blog, a kind of scrappiness about him when you think about how "Through the Wire" came about. No matter what you think about "Through the Wire," revolutionary or gimmicky, that's when this whole, "No one's going to take care of me, but me" kind of thing started to come out. And he's just sort of kept up this scrappiness that probably started out as a defense mechanism that's now just part of this persona because he realize if he wants to get anything done, this is how he needs to do it.

I don't really care about "I should've won" crap as well as this recent craziness because of that. They just seem like yet another one of his misguided efforts to point out the bullshit of the industry he works in or just things about life in general. If he wants to say Bush doesn't care about black people he's going to say it. And while I can cringe at the awkwardness of the moment I also loved it that someone had said that. Same thing with this Taylor Swift thing. Doesn't matter if you think music nowadays is crap or huurrr, how ironic MTV still does the VMAs when they don't show videos anymore. Let's face it, Taylor Swift's gratitude for giving a "country singer" a chance is a little more "look behind the curtains" than she probably intended for it to sound. "Appease the little Taylor fan/Disney kiddies, give her an award...what are we going to do about Beyonce? Oh yea, well she can win the overall award then." You know what, it *is* a bit of a joke, it's like kid's beauty pageants. You get Miss Supreme, then Miss Overall Grand Beauty, oh but you can still get, Miss Photogenic Supreme in your age group, everyone gets a crown and pats each other on the back. It *is* absurd. And Kanye's all, "Whatever, man."

Look, Imma, let the rest of y'all finish. I'm glad you want to discuss this, but Kanye is the best fucking troll of all time. Of all time.

He just seems to genuinely not realize how bad of an idea something is until he does it.

Yes. And this is part of what I like about him.