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21 July 2007

Calling all decorator bunnies! Okay, so we have this beagle. She, at times, does not like to go outside and one of her favorite alternative spots is RIGHT NEXT TO MY SIDE OF THE BED.[More:]

We'd been covering the odor up with Febreeze but it's been getting steadily worse. When we got back from vacation we finally decided it is time to get that carpet outta there. So I'm in the process of ripping it out.

Now that we're removing the carpet, it's probably time to redecorate the bedroom. The first concern is the flooring but we will probably paint and do new window treatments. I'll probably post pics once I finish getting the carpet out.

I hesitate to put carpet back in, at least of the wall-to-wall variety. I'm considering tile (atlhough that doesn't seem traditional for a bedroom), wood flooring, or just painting the concrete floor. I'm looking for something sensible and affordable (considering that even if we resolve the keep teh dog out of there, she'll still get back in there once in a while). Am I missing any possibilities for the floor?
A little help, please, to put in a More Inside tag after the title?

The pallet, in the process of being cleared:

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posted by Doohickie 21 July | 13:37
Carpet tiles. In high wear areas, or where you have the kind of recurring pet problem you describe, carpet tiles are a good compromise between wear/cost/cleaning effort and bare floors. Much easier to pull up a few tiles, and replace them from your boxes of extras, than to redo wall-to-wall.

Pergo or other laminate floor would be my second choice. Real hardwood floors exposed to pet urine for any length of time darken, in my experience, even if you've got 3 or 4 coats of urethane on 'em.

But if the dog doesn't have a medical problem, I'd be coming to a new understanding with it, too.
posted by paulsc 21 July | 13:48
bamboo flooring! yes!
posted by taz 21 July | 13:49
oops. bamboo flooring! yes!
posted by taz 21 July | 13:49
Considered "klick-floors"? It's wood-floors in an easy to put together "lego" kinda of style. see here how it's done. They can be very affordable as well, with the way cheaper ranges sold at Ikea (here in Sweden and Denmark anyway).
posted by dabitch 21 July | 13:52
Some ideas:
A. I think painting the floor is a wonderful idea. You might even consider painting a little rug for your puppy, right in his favorite place.

2. Tile is nice too, if not a little cold in the winter. You will need a nice, strapping young man to carry you over the clod tile and into bed.

Roman numeral 2a.
Another big issue with tile and the puppy will be keeping the grout clean. Although there are treatments that can seal the tile and grout from moisture and grit. $$$$ You might even think of a mosaic. Also $$$$.

iii. Another idea, regardless of floor treatment, is to have a kind of shallow box (like a litter box) that slides in and out from under the bed. It can be slid out, and even left out, until company or guests arrive. It can also be silicone caulking sealed or even lined with an open garbage bag, for water proofing and easy clean-up.

Would love to see pic when done. Great fun to you in working it out.
posted by MonkeyButter 21 July | 13:59
oooh, bamboo is sexy!
posted by dabitch 21 July | 14:04
Oh, and bamboo flooring.
posted by MonkeyButter 21 July | 14:04
When I say wood floor, I was thinking of the "klick floors." I didn't know IKEA had that; I may look into that. Costco has some pretty good styles of "klick floors" too, including bamboo which I've been thinking about. Thanks for the ideas so far!

A friend of mine "painted" a carpet into his old house. At first glance, it looked like the room was carpeted (he sponge-painted it to give a depth effect). The idea intrigues me, especially after seeing his results, but I worry that it won't come out just right.

I'm sure there are guides on the net to help guide me though.

I was thinking this would be kind of a pain-in-the-butt project, but it's starting to get interesting. Instead of the same old wall-to-wall, I'm looking forward to having something unique.

If anyone knows of good websites showing alternative flooring ideas, especially for a bedroom, it might go a long way toward helping convince my wife to go with something a little different.
posted by Doohickie 21 July | 14:05
But if the dog doesn't have a medical problem, I'd be coming to a new understanding with it, too.


It's medical problem is that it is a stubborn, knot-headed beagle. And I recognize she is more stubborn than I am. I've tried keeping her out of our bedroom, but the wife and the rest of the family just doesn't enforce it with the vigor I would like. So, in a way, it's not the dog, it's the whole family! And divorce is not an option. ;-)
posted by Doohickie 21 July | 14:07
You may have to sand and revarnish the wood under that carpet. I am not kidding.

I used to work in a rental department. A German Shepherd totally ruined a $1000 per month rental home. The above is what it took to take care of the problem.
posted by bunnyfire 21 July | 14:45
Oh, and I'd swap sides of the bed with your spouse.

I bet the dog would stay out of the bedroom then!
posted by bunnyfire 21 July | 14:46
You could also look at concrete stains and dyes. The ones I have seen are great but I think they were all professionally installed so the cost might be high.
posted by arse_hat 21 July | 14:48
Bunnyfire: It's a concrete slab under the carpet. If we go with wood flooring, we need to lay down new stuff.

Thanks for the link, arese.
posted by Doohickie 21 July | 15:25
I actually know lots about flooring, having specified various kinds for both residentail and commercial, so here's my two cents:

Staining concrete is problematic at best. I've seen professionals screw it up more than once. If you leave the floor unfinished, paint it. It'll be chilly, though, even if you warmed it up with some area rugs.

Tile could be nice, but as with concrete, a little chilly. Also, what MonkeyButter said about grout.

I'd keep away from the wall-to-wall, for the reasons that you've mentioned.

Most carpet tiles are used commercially, and most patterns and colors are geared for commercial use and wouldn't look very residential-y. Some the higher-end ones might have selections that would work. but carpet tile gets expensive, fast.

I would not recommend Pergo. It gouges easily, is not repairable, and is made of vinyl. Vinyl is bad: it offgases, and fills up the landfill. And, it looks like fake wood, bleah.

Bamboo might be nice, but there a couple drawbacks. First off, it scratches easily. It's going to be a minimum of 3/4" thick, which means your transition strips going out of the bedroom and into the bathroom are going to be hefty. And, incidentally, bamboo flooring, despite all the hype, is pretty tough on the enviroment. (It's grown in China, shipped to Taiwan, and then to the States, and that's a lot of fuel. Mostly, though, it's impregnated with plastics, to make it durable: it's a grass, not a wood.)

A hardwood floor would be prohibitively expensive, but doable. The only problem is your transition strips would be enormous: a wood floor in installed over a 3/4" plywood subfloor, so you'd have that in addition to the thickness of the wood itself.e

Klick floors are also called "manufactured wood floors", and that's what I'd go with. They're also usually 3/4", so you'd have that transition strip, but other than that, it makes the most sense. They install easily on a concrete sub-floor, they're not too expensive, and they're pretty. They have a plywood base, and a veneer of actual wood on top, so they look like a nice, real hardwood floor. Best of all, they are usually pre-finished with a catalytic varnish, which is incredibly durable (it what gym floors are finished with).

Another option: linoleum. Linoleum is a natural product (no vinyl), it actually gets more durable with age, you can repair it if it gouges, and comes in an infinite number of colors. It's warmer than a hard surface flooring product, and installs well over a concrete subfloor. It's also relatively inexpensive.

Let me know if you have any questions!
posted by Specklet 21 July | 15:35
I've got a question: tell me more about linoleum. I had no idea.
posted by box 21 July | 15:47
you can do all sorts of funky patterns with linoleum. Mom's apartment had it nearly everywhere, from avocado green in the bathroom hallways to fake cork in the kitchen, it was dead popular around here in the eighties. She removed all of it but the kitchen and bath not because it had worn in the least, just because it had gone out of style. And yes, warmer than tile or anything like that.
posted by dabitch 21 July | 15:55
I'm basing this on the laminate flooring in the kitchen at my mom's house and dog nails - DO NOT GET LAMINATE.

And also do not get bamboo. Out of the options you listed I would seriously consider painting/sealing the concrete. And maybe try an area rug on top (that you do not care much about/can be easily cleaned or carpet tiles.)

Also, any liquid that sits on wood is likely to warp it (same holds true for laminate and bamboo.)

Vinyl will get scratched up too.

Also, try to get the dog on a regular pee schedule. I know it's hard to do with the family but for bone-headed dogs it can really help solve this problem.
posted by fluffy battle kitten 21 July | 16:04
specklet gives fabulous advice. We have Columbia Clic in our entire house except for the bathrooms and kitchen. I like it better than carpet, but the Clic that we purchased is laminate and I wish we would have sprung for the actual wood on top of the plywood base. A friend has the cherry manufactured click flooring. Oh my, it is gorgeous.

I still like the laminate well enough. It was a cinch to put in. You need a chop saw or table saw, and a few tools. Knee pads are a must.

Tile isn't a bad choice, especially the tile that looks like stone. I've seen it rammed up together with very little grout lines visible.

I hate carpet. Only because we're a family of slobs.
posted by LoriFLA 21 July | 16:09
And definitely consider linoleum. Everyone thinks the linoleum I have in the kitchen is tile. It's Congoleum, and the best thing I've ever had. It washes beautifully and still looks new and shiny after 10 years. If I had went for the tile, I am sure it would be looking like royal shit. The Congoleum was actually a little pricier than your average tile, but so worth it.
posted by LoriFLA 21 July | 16:13
I hate to tell you, Lori, but Congoleum in not linoleum, it's a vinyl product.

Linoleum is rarely installed in tiles (although you can do inlays, as dabitch pointed out), because it tends to curl a bit at the edges if in a small piece, and sometimes will de-laminate. Just do straight up roll goods.

When you guys say a laminate floor, what are you talking about? In the business, laminate usually means plastic laminate which is the Formica-like stuff you put on countertops. Not flooring.

With all the pee, I think linoluem is going to be the way to go, rather than the manufactured wood floor. fluffybattlekitten is right: if it's wood, it will absorb moisture and swell and warp.

About linoleum:

It's made from linseed oil, mica, wood flour, and a couple other things, all on a woven jute back. As it ages, it oxidizes slightly and will change color a little bit, so make sure you let any samples of color you get sit out for a few days and get a little sunshine on it, so you can see what the color will actually be. Also, as it ages, the linseed oil rises to the surface a little bit, and forms a patina. The floor will get more durable as it ages. Also, unlike vinyl, it it repairable in the even of a gouge. (This is because the color of the product goes all the way through, whereas vinyl has color only on the surface of the product, and because you can heat-weld it.)

It's easily cleaned, and not very porous, and so is sanitary. It's non-allergenic, and does not off-gas like vinyl, carpet, and carpet adhesive does. It's very durable, so much that I do not hesitate to specify it for a high-traffic commercial floor.

And it comes in a bazillion colors. Check out the Marmoleum brand.

posted by Specklet 21 July | 17:10
If puppy has a favorite spot to tinkle, might be time to just give in and make it a tinkle spot. Put down a wee-wee pad and let the dog do her thing.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero 21 July | 18:37
Seconding that...I think there are beagle sized doggie litter boxes.
posted by brujita 22 July | 00:05
I hate to tell you, Lori, but Congoleum in not linoleum, it's a vinyl product.

Yes, should have been more clear. I know it's not real linoleum. I love real linoleum, will look into that for the next kitchen floor.
posted by LoriFLA 22 July | 08:46
I heavily relate. One of our cats favored the floor on my side of the bed. Just last week we tore the carpet up from that side of the room, and left it from the foot of the bed beyond.

My wife was saying that cat piss does not enhance romantic feelings. . .
posted by danf 22 July | 09:25
Your wife is pretty smart, dan.
posted by Doohickie 22 July | 12:01
I think the wife and I have agreed on a manufactured wood floors (klick floor). We picked some out at Costco, but we didn't buy it yet; we've decided to paint first. We're looking at a bright, buttercup yellow type of color.... totally not like us but it's time for a change.

We have Pergo in our family room, but it's the older, glued type. I've seen enough to know I wouldn't want to use that again, but the wood floor should be okay. With respect to our dear beagle, she doesn't every go to the bathroom on smooth floors, only carpeting, so I think that by not using a carpet we should be good.
posted by Doohickie 22 July | 15:07
Considered "klick-floors"?

You need to be really careful what you get here - the type that Specklet mentioned, with the plywood base and a wood veneer on top are good, but there are lots of cheaper varieties around that have a manufactured wood base (it's called MDF here) with either a timber veneer or a vinyl timber-look veneer on top. DO NOT BUY THESE IF THERE IS ANY CHANCE OF ANY MOISTURE GETTING ON THEM!!! They will swell up and buckle with anything more than a slightly damp rag being wiped over them, so they are completely useless for your purpose. Even if you use the good quality click-floors, you will get some swelling if your puppy does his business on them, because all wood swells when wet. The timber that are used for the plywood base of click-floor is not hardwood, so will swell quite a bit although it will mostly go down as the wood dries out.

Polished concrete is an awesome look if you have or are planning a modern decor, but it can be expensive and difficult to do in an existing home without major disruption.

If you are going to continue to allow the puppy to piss in your bedroom, I think your only options are either linoleum or concrete (painted or polished or whatever, preferably). Are you really sure you can't solve that problem somehow?
posted by dg 22 July | 16:05
Use white vinegar or a commercial product to get rid of any dog pee. If the dog smells it, at all, it will just keeping peeing there. If you use wood, and the dog pees on it, it's not easy to remove the smell.

Painting the concrete would be fun, look cool, and if you don't love it, easy to cover. Stencils might be fun. I've thought about stenciling a canvas rug in my kitchen. But a. I haven't got around to it and b. the dog would eat it.

Real linoleum is available, but not cheap. Lasts a long, long time and comes in some cool looks.

I have rugs over hardwood in most of the house. There's plastic sheeting under the rugs because beagle-y dogs are stubborn, and mine is not at all bright (i.e., he occasionally pees in the house). Rugs are either machine-washable or can be washed in the driveway, a really time-consuming event.
posted by theora55 23 July | 11:54
I hope to solve that problem. But I found out something interesting: There is a certain spot on the concrete that has a really, really deep stain. I tried cleaning it with ammonia, twice, then tried bleach. But.... the dog KEEPS peeing there. I'll try vinegar next.

If I could get my wife to close the bedroom door once in a while, that might help, but she's even harder to train than the dog.
posted by Doohickie 25 July | 22:49
2 hours of blues. || IRC party

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